Sexual Relationships 
Sexual Health 
Argument for: A woman doesn’t want to have a baby. She is allowed to abort it without the fathers permission to do so. If she goes through with it however, and the father doesn’t want it, he is forced to pay child support. The argument for child support is that they both have the responsibility of the child they have brought up, and therefore he is responsible to pay if he leaves that other responsibility by not staying with the child. But a woman is allowed to leave her responsibility of caring for the baby yet not born. They both have equal responsibility, and it is illogical, and therefore men should have a say in abortion.
Argument against: A woman should determine whether she wants an abortion or not. It is her body, and she is the one who will go through labor, and birth, not the man. He doesn’t understand, or know what she is going through. She has the right to her own body, as we have until the day we die, and after that. A man cannot force a women to bear an unwanted child. Therefore a man should not have a say if he doesn’t want an abortion.
What Girls & Guys Said
42 78If they're in a committed relationship sure thing. I think paperwork should be drawn up and brought to a notary as well, stating the guy will financially help support the baby.
I would say yes if he's really want to take the responsibility but if he's just an ass hole, then it's better that he has no saying in important things like that
Yes, but law can't just determine whether or not if he's an asshole. They can't cherrypick, unfortunately.
It shouof go this way - either men have the freedom to sign themselves off of any responsibility or they get a say in abortion. One or the other.
*should
Considering men would still have to pay and deal with the kid if she decides to keep it, then yes. Unless a man can decide to opt out financially if she decide to keep the kid, then yes, men should have a say in abortion because men are also gonna be affected by the outcome.
If it's the man giving birth, sure. If it's not coming out of his body then no.
@1truekhaleesi What about a woman that rapes a man? He didn't get a say in which woman got his seed. It should be his decision if baby is birthed or aborted since he's the victim. If she's raped, she chooses. The victim should choose: male or female.
@tugg-A the victim should always have the say in what happens to the fetus. That's not the case because in 31 out of the 50 states, rapists can sue for custody rights. I wish I was joking.
@1truekhaleesi When she rapes him, he didn't get a say in which woman got his seed. Women can be rapists too.
@1truekhaleesi Once custody is applied though, the abortion was not set forth. Once birthed, the baby is living outside the mother. If aborted, custody doesn't come into play. In 7 states, a rapist gets parental rights too.
@tugg-A I didn't deny that. Actually, I agreed with you. If you want to continue this conversation, I'd rather not repeat myself.
@1truekhaleesi I know you weren't arguing that point. I added that as a bolster to what many women say it their right whenever she's raped, especially. I was implying that men can also claim same thing/right.
@tugg-A
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I don't think the guys should have a say in whether of not she gets the abortion, but I do think if she chooses not to abort despite what he wants, he shouldn't have to pay child support.
@Infynia What about a man not getting a say in which woman got his sperm when she rapes him? He should have a say in which woman gets his seed.
@lnfynia What about a man not getting a say in which woman got his sperm when she rapes him? He should have a say in which woman gets his seed.
you bet your ass he should have a say. 10 years down the road if he finds out he ain't gonna be happy. that's on you at that point. good luck.
Ofcourse we do, why the hell would anyone assume not?
Sure, the girl has the final say but guys might not be ready for a child and know they can't raise one responsibly. So if a guy asks you to abort consider it strongly, he might not be able to stay otherwise even if he wants to.
It isn't about a woman's body. She already decided to spread her legs.
It is about the responsibility and inconvenience of raising a child.
If a man is not allowed to require an abortion, then there needs to be a way that he too can sever parental responsibility. If she has the baby anyway, she should be on her own.
"Decided to spread her legs" what a nice way to put it.
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@danceislife080 I got that from listening to Laura Schlessinger on the radio. However, it is true.
I don't think it's far to have a veto on it as a man simply because it's not my body - that said I also don't think it's fair that if you have a one night stand you're potentially locked into paying support for a child you have near zero rights to see. To fix this I quite like the idea of a "abortion" for men where we could give up all rights and pay nothing at all.
What I do know right now is, as a man, family law is a big F*** you. We have so few rights it's just not funny.
Once again, women what to control everything for their purpose and self benefits.
@RandomBritishGuy94 Even worse is a woman can rape a man and that man may not want his seed to be birthed into her but if she wants it to be, she can.
@tugg-A Then it seems wise for us to limit the parental rights of rapists, doesn't it?
@tugg-A She can do what. So you saying women can do as she please, no. Can they do as they please with children, the answer is no.
@MlleCake Good point.
It takes two so yes. When a woman chooses abortion she's really only looking out for herself.
yeah, it's so selfish to look out for your own mental and physical health & try to avoid getting PTSD, which happens to women who give birth[1] at the same rate as it happens to men who go to combat[2]
[1] www.parentingscience.com/childbirth-trauma.html
[2] www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2891773/
@beautifulangel76 Yep. Abortion is 1 of the most selfish acts there is.
@mistixs She's talking about women who abort the heck of it, to avoid responsibility. Not if health is in danger.
I still can't believe someone just compared becoming a parent to Combat PTSD...
@Neverrrmore Ah, I can't believe that some people don't think it's a life once egg and sperm unite. Sadly, there's people that thinks birth must happen in order to be a life.
@Neverrrmore yeah, god damn those scientific sources that prove that there are similar impacts.
@tugg-A agreed. Very sad.
@mistixs becoming a parent... COMBAT PTSD. Becoming a parent... combat ptsd.
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@Neverrrmore Do you have any scientific sources to disprove my scientific sources?
@mistixs How exactly does that work? The mom is strolling through the grocery story, hears a baby cry, and hits the floor having flashbacks? 🤔 Have you ever been around anyone with actual PTSD out of curiosity?
@mistixs I highly doubt women are getting abortions because of PTSD fears. The main reasons women have abortions are... negative impact on the mother's life (school, work), financial instability, relationship problems /unwillingness to be a single mother and just not wanting to have kids. That study is irrelevant in this convo.
@Neverrrmore Actually, yes. I have bipolar and anxiety disorders, and have been: - hospitalized in the psych ward - spent a year in & out of partial-hospitalization programs for mentally ill people - spent my second half of high school going to a therapeutic school for mentally unstable people Considering the hours I've spent in group therapy, I've spent a lot of time with people of various mental illnesses, including, yes, PTSD. And no, not everyone with PTSD "hits the floor" in public. Many people with mental illness manage to appear "normal" in public, & then go break down as soon as they're alone.
@TaylorSpliff Forcing them to give birth may result in PTSD for them, though. That's just plain abusive.
@mistixs interesting
@mistixs " Should men have a say in abortion?" Was the question not "should men force women to not have an abortion" I think if a women gets pregnant and is thinking about having an abortion , she should discuss it with the "father" because thats what adults do. They discuss, give different points of view and make the best decision.
@mistixs What an absolute joke, just because you're mentally unstable and claim victim hood for the most basic things, doesn't mean it's right. A leaf blowing in the wind probably will send you to hospital in fear for your life. So many weak minded people play this victim shit nowadays, you're not going to get anywhere with a mindset like that. You should seek help, but not for for the reasons you think. Birth is a natural and normal thing. To compare PTSD from childbirth with that of military personnel is ridiculous. Your research is bullshit because anyone can claim they've got PTSD, such as you. These psychological conditions are difficult to diagnose. But when you've given birth AND gone into to combat, lost a leg, held your best friend in your arms as they breathed their last breath while they're covered in bullet holes, seen an innocent child been blown up in the middle of the street before you had the chance to save them... Maybe then you can compare the 2 situations.
@Kkaos Thank you! Exactly.
@Kkaos PTSD is a mental illness. Mental illness isn't always logical. The point is that pregnancy and childbirth can result in many chronic or even lifelong physical and/or mental illnesses/disorders. A woman shouldn't be forced to risk that if she doesn't want to.
@mistixs It's still irresponsible. If you know that you have physical problems or mental health issues and your worried about that then you should use multiple methods of birth control. There are all kinds of things available
@mistixs If anything an abortion would cause PTSD you know that right. Yes childbirth is a pretty traumatic experience but an abortion is potentially worse.
@mistixs And abortions can result in more problems. They aren't the safest thing to do. Forcing a woman to give birth is not going to give her PTSD. If your speaking about your situation then you should take precautions and use birth control and condoms. It's that easy. You can walk through the aisle that has pregnancy tests and find many different forms of birth control.
I assume you want kids? Because an abortion could be bad for someone who wants and loves kids but for someone who doesn't want a kid, and WANTS an abortion, then no, it's obviously not worse than being forced to give birth to a kid you don't want.
@mistixs Again if you don't want kids then be responsible. There's so many different forms of brith control people can get from their doctors and over the counter. If you don't take the proper precautions then that's on you and no one including that baby should have to pay for your mistake.
by the way abortion - having a small lump of cells removed from your body - is 14x safer than childbirth - having a 7 pound human rip itself out of your body. shocker mobile.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE80M2BS20120123
@mistixs You must not know anything about biology. The baby is a clump of cells around 2 weeks but a lot of women don't know they're pregnant until after 4 weeks. By then it's got a body with working organs.
I think both parents can talk about it (except in the case of rape or something similar), but ultimately it's up to the women. If she doesn't want to have a baby and the guy does, no one can force her to keep it.
Yes, since later on the woman can actually go to justice about him refusing to pay child support.
Plus she didn't make the kid alone.
What if he was legally allowed to opt out of child support in that case? I think it would be fair then
Of course he would have to sign something beforehand stating that he was in favor of abortion
@frozenhorizon Ok that's a possible resolution for the matter!
woot
@frozenhorizon i mean i agree lol
I know. woot wo͞ot/ exclamationinformal (especially in electronic communication) used to express elation, enthusiasm, or triumph.
@frozenhorizon oh right! hahaha
Currently, men don't really have any options at all.
They should be able to "opt out". Whether the woman gets an abortion should still be her own choice, but then the man should get the ability to abstain completely. No custody rights ever, and no child support either.
@Kirah In a few countries, men do that rights. What about when a woman rapes a man? He didn't get a say in which woman got his seed and she is birthing a baby she basically stole since it wasn't consent.
@tugg-A blog.business-model-innovation.com/.../...ste.jpeg
Married, absolutely.
Otherwise, unless his "say" is an immediate choice of a "shotgun wedding", no. And he gets to pay child support either way. The time to choose is before you screw.
I think they're welcome to give their opinions. But ultimately the decision is with the woman. She's the one that has to carry the baby, give birth to it, raise it.
@April10 What about when a woman rapes a man? He didn't get a choice in which woman got his seed or if he even wanted any woman to get his seed. She is birthing a baby on stolen seed.
Of course they should. And it pisses me off beyond belief that there are women and men who are in charge of laws, that think other wise. These females did not get pregnant on their own, therefor they should not be able to make the decision to kill their child or not.
If they didn't get pregnant on their own then why is it that men suddenly have full power to choose what the woman should do? Why is it that the woman can't choose?
@lumos No body is saying that women can't choose, what we're saying is that the decision shouldn't solely be up to the woman. People want to agree that it's her body, but when you have another life form inside of you, that does not classify as YOUR body. It isn't YOUR body, it's your baby as well as the man who helped procreate the baby.
In most cases of abortion the baby barely even has what classifies as a body. And how exactly can you compromise with another person when it comes to a pregnancy? It's pretty black and white, either he thinks you should give birth and you do it against your own will, or you have an abortion that he doesn't want.
@lumos A lot of pregnancies get terminated once the baby has already began forming. The man has as much as a right to deciding what happens to his child as the women does. I'll I'm seeing from your viewpoint are double standards. She has to carry the baby against her will? He has to live the rest of his life against his will not having his child. I don't know about you, but I'd rather unwilling carry my child and have them in my arms then have them sucked out of my and ripped apart. Have you even seen abortions? They're awful. If you don't want a child, and you accidentally get pregnant, there are plenty of people who would be willing to take your baby.
@lovelyhoneybones Pretty sad that a 17 year old girl understand this topic better than most adult women it seems. Thank you though for being a voice of reason, you rock :).
Double standards? No, I call it biological differences and the right to bodily integrity. Should your partner also have the right to decide that you should get your uterus removed because he doesn't want any babies? No. You're the only one who has the right to decide what happens with your body. If you don't understand something as basic as that, then you don't understand *human rights*. Your basically saying that it's a double standard that other people don't have the right to decide for you what surgeries you should or should not have lol. Just because you'd be able to do something, doesn't mean other people would. I never said abortions are pretty? And abortions that occur when the embryo is less than 9 weeks old are induced by mifepristone and misoprostol. It's basically like a miscarriage.
abortion should be illegal. that's a sin. its a murder. if you don't want a bay don't have sex. and if you have a baby because of unfortunate events, abortion isn't the answer. there's always adoption. there's always someone out there that can care for it.
So, you're saying that married couples who don't want children should just never have sex? Isn't that a bit unreasonable?
"There is always adoption, there's always someone out there that can care for it." Try telling that to children living in broken foster homes that are currently planning their escapes, or completely being moved around by the system every few weeks to a year. The system isn't all butterflies and rainbows and unicorns and glitter.
@Jessicocoa No. She's saying that if a couple gets pregnant via sex, then they shouldn't abort.
She said if you don't want a baby don't have sex.
@Jessicocoa Nothing wrong with abstaining from sex. People act like having a baby is a side effect to sex rather than a benefit. She and I both believe abstinence should be the only form of birth control. If you have sex, you should take on the responsibilities of a baby and quit being a wuss and trying to cheat. Having a baby shouldn't be a side effect, like I said. It should be a benefit to the sexual man and woman together.
That would be the case if sex wasn't so pleasurable. But it is and I and many others see it as a form of pleasure and a way to be intimate with someone you love. I do not and will never see it as "baby making".
@helloitsmethere This!! I always hear "The cure for cancer could be in the mind of an aborted fetus".. er whatever. But it could also be in the mind of someone already alive but aren't given a chance to have a good education.
@Jessicocoa Sex is pleasurable but purposely preventing a baby is immoral and wrong. I never said you shouldn't have pleasure from sex but you should not purposely prevent a life. If you truly loved your partner, you wouldn't rob them of the fruit of their gift: a baby. How can you love somebody, yet want to prevent the blessings of that fruitful sex. The Bible even says marry and multiply, not marry and use birth control. Sex without marriage is not recognized relationship, neither is boyfriend/girlfriend a relationship. It is a placeholder to a potential marriage relationship.
@helloitsmethere Of course there is kids who aren't happy of being at a foster home. Thanks for pointing out the obvious but are you telling me is better to kill them then? if you don't like the idea of having to give them away then 1) don't have sex thus you won't have a baby and therefore have to give them away. Problem solved.
And of course you can have sex but if you have a baby ACCEPT THE RESPONSIBILITY. that's the point of my comment.
"Just don't have sex" What if the mother was a thirteen year old who got raped?
@helloitsmethere
"Just don't have sex"
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*I hope you sense the sarcasm here
@helloitsmethere Did you not read my first message? i did explain it, that if you're in an UNFORTUNATE event, then you can resolve to adoption. Do you not realise that you don't have to choose to kill them? That's what I'm trying to say here for crying out loud.
@danceislife080 Ikr! It's gonna solve the WHOLE problem!
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@helloitsmethere It is still her responsibility because it's a life. If a woman rapes a boy that's 13, he still has to pay child support if the woman has the baby.
Do you whatever you want honestly, i know at least i won't be a murderer and have blood in my hands.
@tugg-A Exactly!
@Bananaqueen1 so the child should live through her rape pregnancy, probably has to take LOADS of days off from school since pregnancy symptoms aren't easy to deal with, she has to get TONS of tests for STDs since she got raped by a total stranger because who knows where he has been, her pregnancy is high risk since she JUST started puberty like two years ago, oh and the fact this might psychologically damage her for YEARS. If she wants to have the abortion, then so be it. This is a VERY valid reason to have one. Her body isn't entitled to be any rapists' breeding ground. Also, I get where you are coming from with this 'it's a sin' thing because I'm a Christian as well, but I also understand that not every woman is a Christian in this country, nor does every woman believe in the same things as I do. Personally I wouldn't have an abortion myself (depending on the situation... like the one I explained) but I wouldn't want to take away the rights of another woman being able to choose...
hey like i said you do you. i personally don't believe in abortion even in the situation you mention. but each to themselves.
@helloitsmethere True but when a woman rapes a man, his body shouldn't be violated either. Whoever was raped should choose if baby is birthed or aborted. The victim should always choose: male or female.
My ideal partner doesn't want kids either.
You can have sex all you want, just use protection or birth control to prevent unwanted pregnancy. I strongly recommend waiting until marriage, but to each their own! :)
Besides, there are ways you can pleasure yourself outside of sex. The reason why many sex toys are open to many.
Being married isn't going to change the fact that I don't want kids.
@Jessicocoa You're nineteen, you're not supposed to be having kids anyway.
Not now, not ever.
@Jessicocoa To each their own :) Personally my partner and I may want kids someday because we would be able to have a healthy and beautiful marriage and raise children of our own. Sex is very pleasurable, which is why two people engage in that to share a special bond with each other... which is what my partner and I intend on doing upon marriage. <3 👰🏻 💍 You don't have to want kids, just be sure to use protection in case you do decide to have sex.
no they are not equal to women. Women are superior to them.
Of course they should. What kinda question is this
so should I accept your follow request? 😁
"Women are superior to men" Right... because women are totally stronger and more independent than men, mentally, emotionally and biologically. 😑
@sweetlivy You are a feminist. And I wonder why you were retarded. Now it is all creal to me. Read boys @makingmehiiiigh @Chico_brah. She also commented in our group convo. She blames me for thinking I am better than other women. BUT she just said women are better then men. Isn't she a hypocrite?
That's literally what you said in your response... don't turn it around to me and act like you said no such thing.
Guys! please help me! I can't with this girl. Teach her sarcasm
Sweetheart, I used sarcasm in my response. I pretty much know what sarcasm is. Try again. :)
Calm down ladies.. Just got home.. I'm about piss and go to sleep. Don't make me come and spank both of you now..
Looks like sweetivy has a crush on you though.
@Chico_brah she does. She called me names but still hasn't canceled her follow request hoping I will someday accept it. You are experienced. you know how desperate and bitter girls become when their crush ignore them 😂
Bro what the fuck 😂😂
Chico maybe she wants ME to spank her butt? 😂😂😂
@sweetlivy Alright. She had a pretty convincing story. Think I'm going to have to spank you boyo.
Lol hey she could roll that's way who knows.
Ew, no. I'm not lesbian nor will I ever be. I love penis, sorry. <3 😂
@sweetlivy woah you coming onto me? Chill boyo
you can hold her hands and let me spank her. I am not that strong. I need your muscles. man
you don't have to love a vagina for wanting me to spank you 😂
Are y'all high? 😂
I think she wants my dick.. What do you think?
@Chico_brah @Llmllm Guys. Seriously. What the fuck.
I feel like she wants some genitalia but I am not sure if that is a penis or pussy
😂😂
A penis will do things for me that no body part on any human ever will. I'm sorry. I would personally never be attracted to a girl.
@sweetlivy you seem to have gone out of the convo. Don't act like a virgin. I mean Don't be passive lol
She'd be lucky to have the honor of going down on me. She wishes she could get at us. Too bad for her I'm taken and you're abstinent Af. Don't think it would happen even if you were a slut and I was single anyways though.
@Chico_brah if I were a slut you wouldn't be taken 😂
That's a negative. I'm loyal. Sweetivy might have a shot depending how much she can lift on the bench press though.
I was joking. But if you are that serious. Then I will be serious too. I am religious. This means I am against women to women and men to men sexual contacts
Lol I know. I slay cheater on spot.. Well this guy doesn't even have the opportunity to cheat. That's how pathetic he is.
www.girlsaskguys.com/.../q2340911-should-every-sexually-experienced-women-that-is-in-a-relationship
I'm religious too
that guy doesn't even hide he wants to cheat. But I hope when you said sexually inexperienced guys cheat you didn't mean sexually inexperienced people cheat too. lol I think sexually inexperienced men and sexually experienced women are more likely to cheat than sexually experienced men and sexually inexperienced women. Agree?
Haha that retarded question, he's probably gay 😂
lol you call any retarded guy a gay 😂
Don't go full liberal/feminist on me 😒
lol I am sooooo anti feminist and anti liberal
I despise liberals and feminists as well.
A lot of liberals are atheists too
I am with you here
My best friend is actually both a liberal and atheist. :( I wish I could help her, but I cannot personally change her views. It's her personal choice and it would not be my place to try hindering what she believes. Although I just wish I could take her to church with me and we could worship together, but I don't see that happening any time soon 💔
I'm agnostic but can't stand liberals where I live for the most part either. Can I join your bff club or what boyos?
@Chico_brah Why do you keep calling me that? 😅
@sweetlivy You'll get used to me if you're going to be active on here. Just roll with it boyo. Don't question it.
@Chico_brah Haha okay..."boyo." 😂 @Llmllm Yes that's true. But she's literally someone I've known since I was little. Her sister as well. We lost contact for about 5 years but reunited in 2012. She's definitely changed her religious views over the course of about last year, when she first began attending Christian Brothers University. Kind of ironic considering it's a religious college but somehow changed her belief in God.
I am so happy I am a believer
Very interesting and engaging conversation here :)
@Llmllm me too! :) <3 I want to be a missionary someday in the future and bring other people to Christ. It's my passion. I also want to do kids' ministry!
@Llmllm One time on Easter Sunday I volunteered and helped the kids' Sunday school class. It was such a wonderful experienced.
*experience lol
@sweetlivy if I knew you're religious I wouldn't be rude to you. Stop paying attention to atheists. God gave them free will. They chose to not believe. And may God judge them.
I agree, I just want her to believe in God because she's someone I've known since I was very young... and I can't even bring up certain topics around her like I can most of my friends. Her sister is agnostic though.
@sweetlivy
PM me boyo 😁
WHY DO YOU GUYS CALL ME THAT 😂😂
"My body, my choice"
Ok then, but the dad doesn't HAVE to be around if you CHOOSE to have a baby he doesn't want.
why would you even call yoursrlf a dad in this case - you automatically reduce yourself to simply be a sperm donor, aka biological father. Dad is a word for a man who take responsibility to look out for his child no matter with or without being with the child's mother
@Nomad2 you're right, I should have used the word "father" I've seen and heard about too many men getting "trapped " by women! If the woman KNOWS the guy doesn't want the baby, her keeping the baby is a stupid decision. In essence she is blatantly ruining society by CHOOSING to have a baby in an absent father situation, which is extremely high odds that child will become a societal burden down the road (welfare, crime, K-12 school performance, etc.)
and what do you think of the fact that many men would do anything it takes, including telling women they want to have a family and kids with them, just to have sex? Some women do fell in love with the wrong type and they believe every word the lying bs artist tells her, and most of loving women would luke to have kids to born out love not because it is time to go and find a husband to reproduce some offsprings. By the tine these women realize the men have been lying many of them do get pregnant. How is this trapping men? Men do get trapped due their own irresponsible actions and innapropriate behaviour. If he doesn't want to "get trapped" he needs to be clear about his intentions and bloody control his lust. It is only natural for a woman who loves to chose life as opposed to a murder of her unborn child Yes, lying and irresponsible (often a combination) men get caught out but no less than poor women who firstly have broken heart, secondly stressed out by the decision making
Those men who fell trapped by unplanned and unewnted pregnancies do trap themselves by either being dishonest with the women just to get laid and therefore playing these womens' feelings, or by neing plain stupid and not using protection - still playing womens feelings and then when a baby happens by not wanting to take any responsibility for their actions and putting all the blame on women