Questions for the oldies, The rise in the number of incels is because standards have slipped?

[purplepoppy]

When I look at old photographs one of the things that strikes me is everyone looks healthy and in good shape. You hardly see any fat people in old photos, certainly not in the numbers you see today. Everyone seems to take pride in their appearance even the poorest people taking care to make themselves presentable. Talk to old people and you'll struggle to find one who had trouble getting sex.

Fast forward to modern times and so many guys struggle to get even a blow job. I look at so many photos of guys now and think thank fuck I've got a vibrator.

So my question is aimed to the older ones here, is the reason so many younger men struggle to get laid is standards have slipped?

[BeenThereLovedIt]

I hate to say it, but I think feminism is the cause / reaction component here.

My generation never really had to consider or worry about things that today's young men do. like these:

* Always worrying about texting, do I respond right away? Do I send a smiley or wink? Was that emoji she sent me supposed to be funny or mean? OMG dating sucks.

* If she wants to sleep with me, do I dare ask her to sign a consent agreement on film? Or do I just throw caution to the wind and take life-altering risks?

* Social media, same issues as texting.

* Why won't she ever just put that fucking phone down?

* Always having to be aware of perceived sexism and always read between the lines. Men have been harassed to communicate on the Girl's level, having to learn and speak her language, yet not be allowed to communicate with her on his own level, or somewhere ideally in-between.

* Who pays for dinner? Am I a dick for asking about it? Does she now think I want her to pay her share? How pissed off would she get if I say nothing and assume I'm buying? Fuck, there is no winning answer.

All that said, a lot of men are just like "fuck this, it's too fucking much, I'm out"

[MannMitAntworten]

I would say it goes beyond just standards. If anything I would say it has more to do with people forgetting how to be social towards one another. The advent of the internet gave us “social media”, however people now exist in their little vacuums from their safe space of home. A strange segment of men and women have become so damn filled with social anxiety that they live their lives online and are anxious when in public around other humans. So they rationalize it as some sort of bizarre conspiracy that women have become this monolithic movement that hates men and only wants them for their wealth and status via voices on the net and women believe men, again, through the net are believing men are all predatory creatures seeking to only to fuck them or make them stay at home wives/servants purely for “domestic duties” and child rearing. Thus there is a growing belief by both sexes that the opposite sex is out to get them this is born the term “incel” as a result of their bent social belief of one another and why they cannot form anything meaningful.


If they would put down their digital devices they may actually realize neither side is out to get the other and rally are quite approachable and would even the self ascribed bellow average can actually form a meaningful connection with the opposite sex.

[Anonymous]

I don’t think it’s because of weight. There are a lot of fat women out there too. I think there are a couple of things happening. You have some guys who only want a “ hot” girl, even though they’re no prize themselves. Then they get frustrated and angry when they can’t attract those women, when they should be looking for a girl in their own league. Then you have the influence of technology and social media. Virtual interaction is replacing personal interaction and you have a generation of guys who never put down the x- box long enough to learn how to approach and talk to girls.

[SarahP080102]

I think women are more selective, and it is also more socially acceptable for women to stay single longer.

[Lliam]

Yeah, more young guys probably aren't in great shape, mainly because they aren't out being active all day. They also don't have social skills because they spend their time on social media instead of interacting with real people and learning from their peers.
At the same time, their standards for women have become unrealistic, again because of social media.

When I was young, there were a lot of really pretty girls. But we didn't compare them to fake Instagram images. Normal girls - girl next door-types - are pretty as hell.

At the same time, it's possible that girls have higher standards for guys, too. Guys aren't expected merely to be fit, but to have bulging muscles and washboard abs.
As a consequence, both girls and guys are insecure about their own looks and have unrealistically high standards for each other.

[Avicenna]

I think there are multiple things at play here (in no particular order)

-Guys are lazier about approaching women and making themselves presentable than when I was a young adult or in my 20s. Online dating and especially social media carry the lion's share of the blame for this because you don't have to actually physically approach a girl anymore.
-Girls' standards have in more cases become unreasonable so it's harder for guys to get laid.
-People get less pleasure from relationships so they are less likely to see them as an imperative
-High cost of living in lots of places and economic uncertainty has damaged a lot of people's financial well-being and prospects.

[Angelo75]

And then there's that thing called computer/videogames. You can sit for hours without moving.
Just another hobby that would mean "not moving around enough".
I'm not saying that its the source of all evil cuz knitting, puzzles etc... they did exist already.
I'm just saying, another hobby came along that a lot of people are doing, which means not being out moving your body.

[Texaskid1]

Feminism destroyed men.

Men are bad...
Masculinity is toxic...
Everything is harassment...
Believe all women...
Don't need no man ( fish bicycle..)

Feminism has done a fine job of brow beating men , destroying the family, and creating a certain hostility between the sexes. It does not surprise me that so many men today have trouble with women.

[MadBoy]

Maybe because we've kept our eating habits while adding more horrible things to our diet, and became more sedentary as technology and general laziness became more of the norm? Think about it, we've been getting worse and worse with what we eat and what we do as time goes on. We live longer lives than them but only because doctor's know how to shove a tube in the right way at the right place.

[Ianto]

Might the absence of lard arses in old photographs be because they didn't have modern medicine keeping them alive?
I do think you have a point, though. Back when the apex of ambition was the prettiest girl in the village, people could be fairly happy with any reasonable looking partner. Now we all aspire to Hollywood Star looks, porn star sex, and intellectual conversation. How many people do you know who match those criteria?
A significant problem for youngsters is that they are all told they have intrinsic value, and deserve the best. Nobody gives them a realistic view of their position in the "pecking order". And if you don't emotionally understand your position in the dominance hierarchy, you can't function properly in society.
I suspect blocking the natural interplay of children ("bullying") has caused serious social problems.

[Pete671]

I think young guys often are more insecure, more afraid of rejection, and not so confident in social situations which might lead to finding a girl,,,
I also believe girls have actually raised standards, with more realising they don't actually need a boyfriend to feel their life is complete,,,

[AlexDeLarge]

I'm not sure but I blame the accessibility of porn. Young Guys are so easily fooled by it and think it's so easy to get it now. Especially when you see so many gross guys getting it from beautiful girls in porn.

[Valnac]

I’m definitely in shape and proud of it.
My girlfriend calls me a stud.

[EstevanMadrid898]

🤣 I don't have problems at all it's the complete opposite actually

[Anonymous]

Society changed to the worse...

[Anonymous]

Standards no

It's late state capitalism, slowing down and dumbing down society before they select the prefect specimens to move away from this planet
The rest will be kept to mine the last resources for the new planet before this one is left to it's own devices until it either burns up or the last cannibal runs out of limbs to dine on and starves

[Anonymous]

"I look at so many photos of guys now and think thank fuck I've got a vibrator." is part of the reason. Also people's ideas and standards are unreasonable.


Females want:
a nice guy that's sweet but a "bad boy"
man with money,
man with low partners but wants him to be a porn star in the bed,
with a house but free to move and travel,
a 8 pack, built like a fictional character but. not self obsessed,
hung like a horse,
And so many other BS must have's and when they can find this fake non-existent guy they are thankful they have a vibrator or become a lesbian.


You don't see guys doing this and getting away with it.

[Anonymous]

i don't care the end is about to start people will die

mark of the beast

[Anonymous]

that's not the reason. I was in the best shape of my life when I wasn't getting laid between the ages of 16 and 27.

I worked out religiously and was shredded. I was on the swim team throughout high school. I was horny all the time

I didn't start getting laid untill I was in my late twenties early thirties when I let myself go completely. Go figure