Sexual Relationships 
Sexual Health 
Lately, there has been this MGTOW movement that is rising. Many tend to demonize them and bash them to feel better for themselves, or because they are programmed to do so, but the MGTOWs arguments aren't without merit.
There are injustice and double standards in society sure. Yes during a divorce women have it better usually. Yes, they are more likely to get the kids. Or when the crime of rape is executed by a woman the penalties and moral condemnation by society are much lighter. Yes, women get much easier certain types of jobs. And yes being a pretty female opens many doors in life. And in the dating game its women that choose mostly.
But there is an equal amount of double standards serving men. Like getting certain jobs that are considered "male dominated", being the logical ones versus women the emotional ones. Supposedly being better at finance. Handling stress situations better...
MGTOWs make a certain huge and self-sabotaging mistake though.They choose to only search for the evil and injustice in women and not actually introspect the evil and injustice within themselves.
Despite the general perception of MGTOWs as basement dwellers that are just bitter on girls not giving them sugar, many are divorced men with kids. Many had relationships etc. They claim women are bad in certain ways. Can you really put all women in a category due to some bad experiences though? In the end, who chose this bad/manipulative/cheating/never satisfied/whatever else woman in the first place? Wasn't it you?
Men are guilty about choosing a bad partner as women who constantly whine "where did all good men go" are. When we are not spiritually mature, and our heart's desires are tainted and we pick people with our lower instincts as our criteria, we are in for a heartbreak. You should also consider your own stagnation during a relationship that can cause problems to your partner in the long term.
In my opinion, the problem is not the moral degradation of women or the injustice in the society. These are just byproducts of the main problem. The problem in our society is that we all, literally, NEED JESUS. Christ transforms your life, your heart, your desires. If men instead of being carnal playboys showed women the good path by advancing spiritually themselves. Women would inevitably follow. I deeply believe that its men who shape the morals of society. Say from social mimicry, say from peer pressure women, would feel the need to adapt, and everyone's lives would become better.
When boyfriends though are perverts. When they have certain addictions. When they use and discard women. its normal that toxic people will be produced in the process. When people face relationships as a codependent parasitic symbiosis instead of the union of two mature self-sustainable spiritual individuals. When families don't give timeless values when kids are leafs in the wind, what kind of foundations can they develop? That's why I mock conspiracy theories about social degradation. Yes, cultural marxism exists, but the perpetrators of the disease are no one else but our selves.
The problem isn't specific genders, the problem is narcissism in our hearts that makes the world the shit hole it sometimes is. As for people mocking you for being on a spiritual path. Rejoice! If they feel the need to throw poison at you it means our by the grace of God virtuous life indirectly judges their own spiritual shortcomings, and that you are already on a good path if you have such sudden enemies. You can't please everyone and you shouldn't. You should only please God and through that, you will be able to truly develop and share godly the love with everyone as well. To the degree we ostracised God from our lives to that degree injustice will keep ruling the world.
But it doesn't only apply to men. Women could make the first step as well in spiritual development.
So... feminists and MGTOWs, you now know how you can "fix others" by fixing yourself first of all. We want to remove the little toothpick from others' eye when we have a huge log stuck in ourselves. That's why all political ideologies fail as well. Thanks for reading.
What Girls & Guys Said
10 49MGTOW is bullshit but I think some of their ideas do have merit. And you might think that makes no sense. Oh but it does.
If you look up the definition of bullshit it means dishonest or deceitful but NOT incorrect.
I think MGTOW ideas are actually ahead of their time but I think the reasons why they do it are dishonest. They just don't wanna bother themselves with WHAMEN so they just run away. I know people and I know nobody can run away from their own emotions unless they are mentally sick. Not even priests. They should do it because they wanna be celibate NOT because women are difficult. Is the old "is your fault" trick. No is not women's fault and women didn't make you do it. You did it. Is dishonest.
But their ideas are indeed ahead of their time. I forsee MGTOW being huge in the future and even a women version of FGTOW or other GTOWs appearing when we will perfect sex bots, virtual sex and artificial womb. At that point sexuality will be optional. But AGAIN people do it because they CHOOSE to not because is WHAMENS FAULT!! Please man. A lot of MGTOW are cowards and they hide under women made me do it but in reality they are just kissless virgins who find it too hard.
The people who started MGTOW tho are very smart people. I've been following it for a while.
MGTOW like feminism is a place where losers hide to find a safe space so they stay lazy and losers forever.
You say mgtows are lossless virgins Dude, i have a friend, he slept with around 200 women, he isbone the biggest players/pick up artist in my town, he has gone mgtow. After so many hook ups, he decided that all women are good for is sex and no drama. He avoids relationship and now a full MGTOW. Sex bots, surrogate mother, artificial womb etc are for real, And you will be shocked to know that most men now days are avoiding relationships and emotional involvement, they just hook up with women and that's it. So they might not know that they are mgtow, but they actually are mgtows.
You obviously have not been schooled "yet". Most probably because you haven't been with enough women. MGTOW is not about celibacy it's about men balancing out this great big mess that feminism created. We were sort of blindsided by this, sucker punched if you have it, dazed a bit and confused. MGTOW can take on many different meanings but the foundation of the movement is for men to get strong again and stop being "pussies" chasing these crazy creatures, called feminists. Did you ever hear, "Behind every great man is a great woman" . Well that does not exist. Men cannot depend on women anymore for any type of support which used to be a driving force behind a man. So men need to make it on their own. Taking a break from the insanity of chasing crazy women is what MGTOW is about. Learning how to be a man. Getting your house in order and living life on your terms and being proud of it, without the influences of these feminist ideas and judgmental women that are out there.
MGTOW is about self improvement and most importantly not marrying. In a nutshell at least... I've slept with over 20 women... maybe not a huge number but my point is I have experience and I can attest to what many MGTOW's say. I don't validate myself with banging women anymore, I just happen to still be sexually attracted to women. I'm not celibate, but I know enough about how women work and how society works, and laws to make an easy decision which is staying away from marriage. Is that simple
@alessandro_02 Marriage is a liabiity no doubt and really should be undertaken only if you have a need to have children and are capable of going into it prepared knowing what disasters may lay ahead. It's very hard now with tuitions soaring to record highs, cost of living being higher, homes at record highs, clothes , food costing more than ever, and then you have that horrible invention of facebook where every wife is posting her children, vacations , cars , homes etc.. to make the other wives jealous, therefore putting tremendous pressure on the husband to get her the same things. It was not like that 30 years ago or even 20 years ago. So before getting married , you have to think it through and have the knowledge that MGTOW offers is a big big help in helping you reach an informed decision.
@RealManAdvice "MGTOW offers is a big big help in helping you reach an informed decision." Couldn't said it any better.
@Hungry_Shark You have on one side people who slept with too many women and on the other side people who can't get any women = MGTOW MGTOW is very defensive like Feminism. Feminism = men are bad and scary and big bad wolves MGTOW = women are bad and scary and little sneaky foxed MGTOW is simply a reactionary movement to this last wave of toxic feminism. Feminism was not about hating man originally was for giving women more rights but something happened women got their rights and there are no rights to get anymore so Feminism turned into let's hate on men now and find reasons to fight about. MGTOW is simply a reaction to that. If you are a real badass man you need to be able to face your issues and I admit is not easy but MGTOW you run away from women problems. That's not how you fix society and yourself. We need to work together men and women and challenge each other and help each other. Dealing with problem women helps you grow as a man.
Tell that to a woman. Look MGTOW is men protecting themselves that's all. Women run with the herd. They are sheep. Men are natural loners. When a woman or chickenhead , whatever you want to call her, gets caught up with her herd of chickens, and decides to bash her man. Meaning she will break up with him, divorce him, kick him out , call the cops, whatever... the man has no where to go. The woman always has her friends !! A REAL MAN, like you mentioned has no friends. If your a man and go a lot of friends, your gay BABY!! MGTOW is protection for the Real Men! Not Yik Yaks like Hungry Shark, who can never be a real man!
Ok I started reading this and was thinking this person doesn't have a clue what they are talking about. But then you said the solution is Jesus. Hahaha that's funny. I get the basic idea is to lead by example but in no such was does that mean you need to believe in Jesus.
I don't consider myself a MGTOW but I did give up on trying to date. My reason is because I honestly don't believe there are any women around really worth it. And the ones that are, well you have to sort through all the bad ones first and even then you probably wouldn't find one. So I don't waste my time. I will make my own happiness, I don't need someone else for that. So if I can't find someone that adds to my life, I'll just be alone instead of wasting my time on someone who bring me down. Unfortunately that seems to be most women now days.
Jesus is the way. Why spent the rest of your life and never discover the joys of the soul? They don't compare with the joys of the secular world. It's a huge paradigm shift inside you and you finally get to tell truly meaningful from trivial things. And we hold MANY trivial things as dear up to that point.
Well if that works for you that is great. I don't believe in souls or that there is more to life after death though. This is all there is and after that you are just done and forgotten. I don't need to believe in other things because this doesn't scare me. I think others may nred it because this does scare them tho. I believe life is actually made up of trivial things because in all honesty life is trivial really. So I rather just spend my time enjoying those trivial things that bring me joy and enjoyment. Unfortunately I don't think I will get that from a women or at least it isn't worth wasting my time looking for it when I can just find happiness elsewhere.
You don't believe cause even faith is a gift of the Spirit. (Without Me you can't do anything substantial alone). This spiritual journey is really humbling cause you gradually realise all is a gift. The grace saves very subtly. Even my own faith is challenged frequently, and God some times retracts some of His grace as a test and things get quite shaky. But hey whenever you fall, you can always stand on your feet again.
So mgtow can have sex with Jesus?
So can a 20 year old be as mature as a 12 year old? totally can as proven in gag.
Not a member of Team Jesus... I'm ok with that!!!
Nice take
Even something as seemingly benign as yoga pants is also part of it...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gS6ynw2qUZMMGTOWs should become monks
Let us pose that you're correct. If what you're saying is true, that all political ideologies and social movements are to be solved via religion isn't that just the institution of a theocratic political and sociological movement in the stead of others? That because the movements lack Jesus in them they are doomed to fail and that all movements backed by Jesus are of course going to succeed. If this is the case then why did the old theocracies fail? Even those run by the truly devout?
Christ mixed with feminism is a complete joke.
Ephesians 5:22-33King James Version (KJV)
22 Wives, submit yourselves unto your own husbands, as unto the Lord.
23 For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the saviour of the body.
24 Therefore as the church is subject unto Christ, so let the wives be to their own husbands in every thing.
25 Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;
26 That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,
27 That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish.
28 So ought men to love their wives as their own bodies. He that loveth his wife loveth himself.
29 For no man ever yet hated his own flesh; but nourisheth and cherisheth it, even as the Lord the church:
30 For we are members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones.
31 For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and shall be joined unto his wife, and they two shall be one flesh.
32 This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church.
33 Nevertheless let every one of you in particular so love his wife even as himself; and the wife see that she reverence her husband.
1 Timothy 2:9-10King James Version (KJV) 9 In like manner also, that women adorn themselves in modest apparel, with shamefacedness and sobriety; not with broided hair, or gold, or pearls, or costly array; 10 But (which becometh women professing godliness) with good works
1 Timothy 2:11-12New International Version (NIV) 11 A woman[a] should learn in quietness and full submission. 12 I do not permit a woman to teach or to assume authority over a man;[b] she must be quiet.
Well damn, jesus got no chill
@He-man Well..
Lost me at the jesus business.
Thats why we lose as a society. Because i lost you at the Jesus business. Thats the path that would transform the world in paradise of earth. This personal development is something we owe to our kids and fellow humans.
It unroots the root of all problems in society and fills the gap with love and meaning.
You speak of Jesus which is in the bible but you women still want to be equal to men. In the bible women are suppose to have supporting role to a man not in competition.
@burpzzzzz I am not a feminist. My husband is the head of my family. and i dont say that just for the shake of saying it. i put it in practice daily. but for a man to be a worthy man as a head of a family must be a godly man first. and thats exactly who i married.
You believe that's the path... with zero evidence
Christianity is absurd
Religion does not being people together, it creates walls between them because so much of it becomes lost through the people that practice it... because those people are still suffering from the same problem that the ''non believers'' suffer from. They are often ego led, and generally having a low consciousness that is dominated by the 5 senses, rather than a higher consciousness dominated by multi senses. It is easy to fall into an ego trap when it comes to religion. If you look beyond the barriers, almost, if not, every single religion has the same message hidden in the background. You mention Jesus, someone else mentions another God or religion... what do you get from that? separation. The way to the paradise that you mention cannot come from anything that creates barriers, but an overall way of being that carries the message of all religions may be able to do that.
Humans created gods not the other way around. Dont forget that
@Truthatanycost Spirituality and religions are two different things. Christianity is the opposite of religions. If you get in the essense of things. It can only bring people more closer together. There are no differences and egoisms to wall them appart anymore... .
Christianity is the opposite of religions... how special can you be?
First off going to start by saying I don't identify with being a mgtow nor a feminist, nor a mra. I am a christian though.
I did end up dating a christian girl. Turns out we had a lot in common. I'd say she was a good girlfriend up until the end. She cheated which is what ended things. My point being that people can change people can be deceitful and sometimes a person can turn out to be different than you thought. Though I learned something from the whole experience. I don't place all of the blame on her or women in general.
You were right about we are responsible for who we do choose in life. It's also why I dn't care much for responding and consoling the women who cry out "Where have all the good men gone?" when they choose guys thye know are bad for them. There are a lot of decent men and decent women out there. One doesn't have to be interested in all of them but just patient enough to wait for somene who's right for them if they want a relationship.
That all being said, I'm choosing to stay single and not marry. Reason being is after my last relationship I don't trust myself to pick a decent woman. If picking someone who seemed like a great woman, who was christian and had a good relationship with her family can turn out a complete mess, I'm not taking the financial risk of divorce. No that's not saying all women are bad. Most women are decent people, though the portion of bad women are large enough to be considerably noticable.
Though yeah, I will consider improving myself as always. I'll finish my degree, and try to go for a masters. I'll search for a good paying job work on my side projects. I'd be continuing to learn and master musical insturments, languages, skills. I'd also be aiming to stay in shape. Though most important of all I want to grow in my faith, and aim to make corrections to my lifestyle as needed and sin as little as possible.
If other men follow me, take the same lifestyle, or not, that's their choice. If other men choose to marry I don't really care. All I know is I don't want patterns with my ex to repeat but only next time through a divorce where I'm paying alimoney and child support while living in poverty (I have seen it happen where I live). Since my last break up, life as been pretty enjoyable and fulfilling being single and it's going on 2 years since then. I'm happy and hopefully other people can live lives that make em happy too.
She wasn't a good girl. She wasn't operating under the Holy Spirit. And she didn't truly love you. She only claimed christianity. A person with an active spiritual life and daily prayer can never cheat.
Still she totally seemed like it to me. She went to church with her family, even talked about which parts of the bible she was going through again. Her family was also deeply religious from what I saw. Over the course of 18 months 15 months of which we were dating I did talk to her a lot and see a lot of her family dynamics which were as traditional as they got. It also seemed like she loved me and things were great. The valentines day a few days before we broke up was good. She seemed happy and I was happy. Heck I gave her a Ring from a movie and she wanted to make it a promise ring the Christmas before. I know she's not a good woman. Though if I can go from something like that and have it end with her cheating and treatng me like dirt afterwords, then I obviously can't trust myself to pick. In my eyes even in hind sight things did seem good and she seemed like a great woman. I'm not risking a repeated experience except only with a divorce.
Then you might need to workk on your discretion. Christ told us to tell spirits appart. She had the christian appearence but not the essense. She could be scholastic about the bible but that means nothing. "Know them by their spiritual fruits" as God says.
Yes, and looking back at it even now at the time she seemed like a great christian woman. I'm not going to say she was perfect because nobody is. Though still looking back and seeing her pray before every meal, prayed to God throuhout the day, actually treat people kindness and generosity, and even abstain from sexual relations (she was a virgin while we were together and we kept things pure). So yeah she seemed like a good christian woman and thing in general were good for over a year. Up until the end of the relationship it was good and I would argue that minus the ending it was the best relationship that I've ever had. But my overall point was, if I could pick someone who seemed awesome and yet get cheated on and have them flip and treat me like dirt then yeah I really don't trust myself to pick. I'll stay single (which is biblically considered better than marrying) and keep enjoying life while making cool friends.
I'm MGTOW. Many men are MGTOW. We know what we know and it doesn't matter if women do not want to listen to what we say, or if they simply don't care. The truth is out there and things aren't changing. The laws aren't changing. Social conventions aren't changing. Expectations aren't changing. It doesn't matter. Just leave MGTOW men be, and go fuck the person you claim you "love" with a contract that clearly chains men to a system that hates them. Call it MGTOW. Call it Red Pill knowledge. Call it a "bunch of losers". It doesn't fucking matter because the facts are there. Men have been exploited to the benefit of corporate fucks and women are used as their weapon of exploitation throughout history. It's like that Matrix movie. There is The Matrix itself (the machines, the corporate assholes), then there are the agents (women, feminists) and the people who are being played without even knowing they are being played (Neo) until they realized what the fuck is happening and actually do something about it.
The biggest red pill is Christ Himself. Thats when you tell apart true life from mere function.
- All the examples you listed are institutionalized discrimination. A field being "male dominated" is not.
"Can you really put all women in a category due to some bad experiences though?"
- No, but if you're seeing examples of a system that's against you then I wouldn't blame you for not taking your chances.
- Yes, men have chosen bad partners sometimes too. The point is firstly that there sure seems to be a lot of examples of bad women out there, and secondly to not kick them while they're down.
And then it's just religious waffling from here on out. Though I think it's interesting you'd choose a quote from someone famous for their nihilism/atheism.
God is the boogeyman of adult responsibility. What you need is genuine personal responsibility and existential authenticity. Not to stumble into it with myth and superstition.
"So... feminists and MGTOWs, you now know how you can "fix others" by fixing yourself first of all."
This is true. ^^ But not the way you mean it here. We must not lose sight of the fact that MGTOW was created by feminism. It exists ONLY because of feminism. It exists ONLY as an equal and opposite reaction to feminism. If feminism disappeared today, as it should, so would MGTOW because its sole reason for existing would be gone.
And therein lies the answer. Feminism needs to die. Problem solved. No religion required.
feminism was created for the same reasons. divide and conquer. seperation amongst humans is in the eye of the beholder. Christ said there is no man and woman, slave and free man, black and white etc.
"feminism was created for the same reasons." False ^^ That is not why MGTOW was created. It was created as a force AGAINST the divide and conquer goals of feminism. See the difference? I understand your desire, as a religious person, to try to make "Christ" the answer to all problems. It's not, and the rest if us need to try to solve the problem within the bounds of reality.
That's a matriX though. Not a reality. When you are in one side of any "fence" you are already out of reality. If you experience God inside right now, you would be at peacE with everyone and have no desires from life other than longterm salvation of mankind. You can only change others with your example. The alternative is force but force always rises resistance.
" If you experience God inside right now, you would be at peacE with everyone and have no desires from life other than longterm salvation of mankind." Been there, tried that, it failed. God has done nothing for me because he does not exist except in the minds of people like yourself where he has no opportunity to do anything for people who live in the real world.
You haven't been there. Your body might have been there but your heart? Probably was still back in your mundane desires and old habbits. The door is always open,, have you really ever crossed it? Do you remember the roman officer? The faith he showed? Christ said "i didn't see such faith in all israel, and i saw that in a secular". Did you ever show even a fragment of such faith? How do u expect it to work when you never really opened your heart to it?
How do I expect it to work? How about God doesn't make it so fucking hard to find him, talk with him and believe in him. WHY would a true God be so mysterious and obscure rather than just making himself known? Why would he make it so easy to NOT believe in him. The answer is... he doesn't exist.
I wanted to respectfully say this is a good Take. However, when people on Team Jesus stop judging me from their high horse for the way I live my life, I might be more open to this kind of a proposal.
Well it applies to everyone. And i'm no exception. Society is unecessarily complicated because I make it be. as all of us do.
I was going to comment , then I noticed your... so never mind
This is why religion can never really change society for the better, it creates barriers and allows those practicing to fall into an ego trap without even realizing it.
@Truthatanycost Its not an ego trap. Its an open invitation. If you are at a cake party. and the desserts there rock. and there is an endless buffet, you want to invite others as well cause you can't eat it all yourself and wanna share the feeling.
@Truthatanycost. True , with religion. Although , having a personal relationship with Jesus is (Not) a religion. Religion , is a set of man-made traditions implemented to their ideology of how your belief system should be invoked. With a personal relationship , there's just you and the Lord, period
@Djaaay Not only its personal, things like virtue and sin are all completely revealable things. Not something you just logically understand. Thats why you can't talk about sinning to secular people. They have no concept of it, they see secular behaviors and they seem neutral to them if not virtuous. You have to get in the life of grace TO BEGiN UNDERSTANDING why something is sinful or what true virtue is. God is something like a Sun. His rays of purity 1) make you progressively realise your own sinfulness and imperfection 2) set a whole new bar of what good truly means. its nothing like the lukewarm "be good to everyone" that society says... .
SIN , is anything that interrupte's or distracts me from my assignment that God has given me to do in his name. You must genuinely and completely give yourself and your dead spirit to the Lord to be transformed into a new spirit and being. Thats called being ; born again in a new transformative spirit and saved soul. Untill you do this , non-believers will never be able to understand the scriptures and will undoubtedly find the Bible to contradict itself.
Sure I'll go with this
best of luck!
I don't think this will solve any problems. We got many religions, and some people are not religious at all. One thing that could help even things out is firing judges in every court. They are the ones who make the final decision, and it's usually the wrong one. We need to create some kind of exam for the people who work in law to find the ones who are truly equal and professional. The ones who will not automatically lean towards the woman as being right even though she clearly is not. Maybe create a new amendment or law. What ever happened to "Innocent until proven guilty"? It's the opposite for men. Gotta change that. Then get the strongest MGTOW and Feminist people into one big room with a bunch of police and security guards. Get the men and women to talk about problems on both sides. Try to work something out by understanding each other more. Compromise. Analyze. Get opinions from their suffering kids. That kind of stuff. If nothing works then that's the end of America. Break it up.
Thinking got us where we are. overthinking to be frank. spirituality is about acting. all these loops of bad thoughts vanish at a consciously avid spiritual practice.
That depends on what the individual believes in. For example: Let's say that I'm not religious, and start praying to god. Will my prayers work? No. Because I need to believe in god and other religious things for it to work. My grandmother is Christian Orthodox and often talks about religious things.
You can learn a lot from your grandma. Your prayers are important. God doesn't judge as people do, He will appreciate your prayer from the level you are at. If you pray 1 minute today. and two minutes tomorow. it will grow as a muscle.