Too many men expect traditional roles from women while not fulfilling their own. Why it's harming everyone; and how to build a divine union:

Too many modern men are trying to use things like shame and force to push women into their femininity rather than creating a safe container for their femininity to flourish. This is how modern men, who want a traditional dynamic, are shooting themselves in the foot. Men will never experience the fully embodied divine femininity of a woman until they fully embody their divine masculinity.

First, let's define what divine femininity & masculinity are:

Every human being will have traits from both circles.
Every human being will have traits from both circles.

All human beings have feminine and masculine energies, physically this is reflected in sex hormone levels. Men have mainly testosterone but will become sick if they have no estrogen. Women have mainly estrogen but will become sick if they have no testosterone.

Femininity and masculinity must be balanced within each person before they enter a relationship, everyone's balance is unique to them.

How does this play out in life?

A woman might deeply enjoy being in her masculine energy in her career and then need her husband to create a safe container within their relationship to relax into her feminine when she gets home. She might love expressing her creativity in a free-flowing way but also need time in the outdoors and physical exertion like skiing, swimming, or backcountry hikes. I know I definitely do!

Women of all ages embody all archetypes of femininity!
Women of all ages embody all archetypes of femininity!

Femininity is not entirely soft, there is a "wild woman" archetype that also needs to be expressed in a healthy way as well as the softer mother and maiden archetypes and the wisdom of the crone. The wild woman always gets forgotten because she sounds scary! But the wild woman is FUN! It's the wild woman in her full ecstatic expression when your woman wants to spontaneously jump in the river or dance in the rain with you! It's the wild woman tangling her fingers in your hair and kissing you hard, she's not bad or scary, she's just bold and free. (she is also sometimes referred to as the enchantress, you can see why!)

* I will also mention that even young women have an inner crone too, some more than others, she represents inner wisdom and acquired knowledge and she enjoys teaching those she loves about her passions and helping guide them to good decisions.

Everyone's balance of feminine and masculine is different. A man might enjoy being in leadership and planning adventures with his friends but he could naturally fall into a very nurturing expression of himself with his family, especially with his children. Another man might be extremely connected to his creative side in his career and balance this by designing logical systems for running his home.

My dad, for example, got an almost primal enjoyment out of watching me eat the food he prepared or by packing my lunch in high school and leaving encouraging notes for me to find, so he'd know I felt loved even at school. My cousins used to joke that his monkey brain was saying "Me feed baby! Baby healthy and strong now! Me good father!"

Many men try to suppress their nurturing side believing it is effeminate and weak even though feminine traits can have masculine expressions and vice versa. These are natural impulses that give men more fulfillment, usually in their interpersonal relationships! - nurturing your children and sharing your softer side with them makes them love, trust, and respect you! Who could have guessed!?? And children who love, trust, and respect you mean you have a strong family! If you go to the zoo and observe orangutans you will see older males behaving just like human grandpas and snatching their grandkids away from their parents "Hey! It's Grandpa's turn to play with the baby!!"

This is a single dad but the caption was adorable!
This is a single dad but the caption was adorable!
Men have archetypes as well! the goal is mature expression of them!
Men have archetypes as well! the goal is mature expression of them!

* Keep in mind that some of the immature expressions of the masculine archetypes can be fine as long as they are balanced by a mostly mature expression! For example, the dreamer can be very attractive and endearing to a woman as long as the man is generally stable in his life and doesn't let his dreamer tendencies lead him astray. The masochist can also be fun as long as it is contained to the bedroom and doesn't lead to a man getting off on his own misfortunes and mistreatments in real life (self-harm). The momma's boy can be sweet as long as his closeness with his mother doesn't negatively impact his romantic relationship, or see his wife being forced into a mothering role for him when his mother isn't around! The sadist is also enjoyed by some women in the bedroom but he needs to still have a deep respect for his partner and not let it take over his day-to-day life, or he's simply an abuser.

Women can't "submit" to struggle!

The word "submission" gets thrown around a lot because of biblical language being falsely attributed to human nature (yeah, come for me in the comments I don't care! Not everyone has to be Christian). In reality, it is not "submission" men truly need from a woman but receptiveness. A man provides stability and a woman receives that stability and uses it to create peace and enjoyment for both people as a partnership/family. A man provides proof over and over again that he can be trusted, a woman receives that devotion and trusts his leadership. Women are meant to surrender to good things, a woman's surrender is a gift to her and her partner, it is not a punishment for not being male, as the bible would have people think. A man provides a feeling of safety and a woman surrenders to the pleasure he wants to give her whether that is sexual or in the form of an experience or mutually vulnerable emotional connection.

When it comes to money, the common saying is "buy a woman a house and she will make it into a home." which is a bit simplified but it still applies. Men provide, women receive, and they create something even better! It even extends to biology, men provide a seed, women receive it and if they are in an environment of stability, trust, and love, they choose to create a baby, and thus a family.

Where modern men are getting tripped up is by feeling entitled to always be in their feminine receiving energy OR by expecting slavish obedience just because he financially provides (and then devaluing the work his wife does for their family while he's at work!)

If a man wants a fully "traditional" relationship where a woman does not work he is going to have to create unshakable stability for her to be able to feel safe enough to do that. This means that men who are not yet established in their careers and fully financially stable should not be looking for a traditional woman until they have that strong foundation in place first.

What is required for a fully traditional woman?

- Financial stability and literacy: A woman sacrificing her career and ability to make her own money is an extreme act of trust. Especially because any extended time out of the workforce hurts her chances of getting a decent job if the man betrays her or can no longer provide.

- Sexual discipline: She needs to know that he is a mature man with self-control who will not cheat, be suckered into harmful fetishizes by porn, develop a porn addiction, or worst of all sexualize/abuse his own daughter/s.

- Emotional maturity: A lot of men do not build emotionally strong bonds with their male friends so while a woman might think "I can vent to my friend about this issue, my husband has had a rough week already!" a man will expect his woman to hear allllll of his problems until she is overwhelmed and becomes resentful. You wouldn't put all of your problems on the shoulders of one singular friend, so why do it to your partner? Emotionally mature men have a mentor they can talk to, or even their grandma or grandpa! They seek therapy as a preventative measure and not to try and fix what is already crumbling beyond repair. They cry if they need to and release and work through their emotions before they explode onto the nearest person (usually their wife) and hurt someone they love. They engage in practices like meditation, journaling, and exercise to manage their emotions instead of expecting their woman to manage their emotions for them (again putting her into the very unsexy mother-of-a-grown-man role!)

- Respect for her intelligence: This is the woman who will be helping you raise your children! If you don't think she's smart why are you with her??? If you don't think she is smart enough to make the right decisions what does that say about her decision to trust and build a life with YOU??? Just because a woman is a stay-at-home wife doesn't mean she is any less intelligent than you are. Even if she doesn't have a corporate career she will still have personal passions. She may need a little extra support, like a weekly or monthly cleaning service, so she can write a book or start a small business, and as her life partner, you should support her in that! (Notice how "supportive" is on both sides of the Venn diagram? If she supports your goals and passions you should support hers!) Plus, if she doesn't just feel like a machine that makes milk and cleans up she will remain passionate with you in the marriage!

- A deep understanding of the value of her roles: Too many men with stay-at-home wives devalue their contributions and accuse them of "sitting around on the couch all day" if the house isn't spotless. Nothing can replace a mother's time spent with her children and beyond this the monetary value of all of the services provided by a stay-at-home wife is astronomical. Instead of spoiling and providing for one woman, you would have to pay for a surrogate, a wetnurse, a cleaning service, an escort, a driver for the kids, a personal shopper, a professional organizer, a personal chef, a family secretary, a laundry service, a home nurse, a tutor for the kids, a nanny, a therapist, a gardener, an event planner, a professional potty trainer (yes those exist! lol rich people!) etc. etc. etc.

Is your head spinning yet?? It is much cheaper to just provide for your family and get your wife gifts/ plan dates to show your appreciation!

A man in his feminine receiving energy overworks his wife to an early grave!

50/50 relationships and strictly traditional gender roles do not mix!!! When a woman is working, paying half the bills, AND taking on the bulk of household chores, the mental load of organizing family/household, and childcare she will be pushed into a single mother mindset. Only it's WORSE, because not only is she a single mother to her children but she is also mothering her man! Nothing and I mean NOTHING will kill sexual attraction faster than this! The man will begin to resent his wife for "withholding sex" and the wife will be too exhausted to even really participate in her own marriage, this is why women married to men die sooner than women who are not. It is in our power to change this!

50/50 relationships can work beautifully as well as long as both partners keep a balance between the polarities.

If the man realizes that his working wife is just as tired as he is after work and takes responsibility for half of the housework and child care she will still have the space to relax into her feminine flow, and her sensuality, which will be a great reward for him!

Here a man can embody his masculine provider instinct by thinking of his wife on the way home from work and picking up some of her favorite pastries or by planning regular dates and adventures. He can figure out what is needed for the household without his wife having to write him a list and she can come home, know that he's got the pet food stocked up and the kid's favorite snacks in the cupboard, and have way more mental space for an intimate connection with him!

Buy her a sexy new dress, lay it on the bed and tell her to get ready, the kids are already at their grandparent's house, and you have a whole date night planned out. Her man has taken charge and she doesn't have to worry about anything, her man has it all planned out, she just needs to relax into her feminine and enjoy. Surprise her with a bubble bath and movie tickets if you get off work before her, it can be simple too! Your wife will be excited to come up with her own little surprises for you in return. Especially, when she is given the space to only worry about half of the duties of running the house! There will be new lingerie under her sun dress that she gives you a mischievous peak of during dinner, or secretly purchased tickets to a sports game you want to see. 50/50 can provide fun opportunities to play around with the masculine and feminine polarities too!

So men! Step out of your whiny little boy "gimme" energy and embrace your mature divine masculinity. Trade clowns like Fresh And Fit for Kings like Byermeas a revolution is coming and you don't want to get left behind!

no amount of shallow hookups will ever compare to divine union
no amount of shallow hookups will ever compare to divine union
Too many men expect traditional roles from women while not fulfilling their own. Why its harming everyone; and how to build a divine union:
7 2

Most Helpful Guys

  • I agree with the basic premise that men need to pull their weight and do their job, and that many aren't. I've advised men about this many times, here and in person.

    But it needs to be mentioned WHY men aren't doing their part: society has been demonizing men for the last 50 years, from school (where hands-on learning has been phased out, often along with sports and even recess) in favor of teaching styles that favor girls. In the workplace, everything is sexual harassment and "toxic masculinity" and "patriarchy." And at home, there's been a massive increase in single parenthood and divorce (women initiate divorce 80% of the time), so more than half of boys grow up without a father in the home. Worse, many of them grow up with Feminist mothers who actively feminize them.

    Is it any wonder that so many boys are not becoming men given that the world seems intent on preventing them from doing so?

    This is just as bad as society masculinizing women, and it's the same root cause: feminism. This is why so many people, men and women both, are pushing back against Feminism.

    • Late-stage capitalism is to blame, there are around 5 men who own most of the planet, humanity has never been this economically unbalanced before and it is creating chaos. Sexism promoting toxic masculinity is to blame, Feminism is necessary, it is the only reason women are even treated like human beings. Mature men can find a space within that movement because they are secure within themselves and realize that it is still deeply needed. It's the same way anti-racism isn't the issue for sometimes being "too aggressive" about fighting for equality, or annoying white people, racism is the issue. If you look up the greatest most divinely masculine men, they are feminists. Many of the men you probably look up to are feminists John Hamm, Jason Mamoa, The Rock, Stephen King, Hayao Miyazaki, Daniel Craig, Kurt Cobain, Sir Patrick Stewart, Anthony Bourdain etc. The saying goes: Men of quality, do not fear equality. Mn of quality also realize that feminism is more than just the shallow pop-feminism they see on social media!

    • "Many of the men you probably look up to are feminists John Hamm, Jason Mamoa, The Rock, Stephen King, Hayao Miyazaki, Daniel Craig, Kurt Cobain, Sir Patrick Stewart, Anthony Bourdain etc." These are NOT the men I look up to, nor most men that I'm aware of. It's hilarious that anyone could think that. You aren't wrong, though, that a number of billionaires (and billionaire families) are pushing this agenda. George Soros openly funds lots of the things that are destroying western society, but he's far from the only one - Bill Gates is another who is doing this openly, but there are a number who prefer to stay out of the spotlight, and push the agenda through donations and foundations, or, like Blackrock/Blackstone, though monetary policy. Capitalism isn't the problem, though, but rather CORRUPTION. Politicians get bought off, or they get blackmailed, and they do what they're told, and one of those things they do is remove regulations that were intended to protect against out-of-control influence. The SEC, for example, has allowed lots of mergers among companies that are far too large to be merging, and with far too few competitors. Such mergers weren't possible 50 years ago, but more and more changes to regulations now allows most mega-mergers to happen, and make people so incredibly wealthy that they have far too much individual influence. But, no, Feminism is absolutely NOT necessary. Egalitarianism is necessary, but Feminism goes FAR beyond equality, and there's no such thing as "toxic masculinity" - there's masculinity, and there's toxic behavior, but the two are not equal or even particularly correlated. That's a radical feminist concept to push all responsibility onto men, and it's both untrue and also bad for everyone, including women.

    • Egalitarianism is a cowardly and cheap cop-out. Basically what most men mean when they say they hate feminism and we should be egalitarians instead is "I don't want to hear about your oppression, actually I'd rather you shut the fuck up about it because it benefits me and ideally I'd like to just pretend it doesn't exist!" It's like telling people of colour that anti-racism doesn't cater to white people's delicate feelings enough so we need to start a race neutral movement that really just ignores their oppression and call it "greyism" or some shit.

    • Show All
  • Buy her a sexy new dress, lay it on the bed and tell her to get ready, the kids are already at their grandparent's house, and you have a whole date night planned out. Her man has taken charge and she doesn't have to worry about anything, her man has it all planned out, she just needs to relax into her feminine and enjoy. Surprise her with a bubble bath and movie tickets if you get off work before her, it can be simple too! Your wife will be excited to come up with her own little surprises for you in return. Especially, when she is given the space to only worry about half of the duties of running the house! There will be new lingerie under her sun dress that she gives you a mischievous peak of during dinner, or secretly purchased tickets to a sports game you want to see. 50/50 can provide fun opportunities to play around with the masculine and feminine polarities too!

    Great example.

    • Thank you!

Most Helpful Girls

  • Great take! So much to this but in a nutshell, parts modern society pushing femininity has the concept of femininity all messed up to the point where it’s now so performative. Many men today think femininity is about being soft, submissive, letting the man lead and enjoy having babies, cooking, cleaning, and knitting. It’s really disappointing to learn how little is understood about what feminine embodiment really looks like and what it takes for a man to be worthy of a feminine woman. But I do think writing takes like this is a good place to start.

    • Thank you! and yeah most modern people's idea of femininity is a reductive cardboard cut-out idea of what it is. Not something that can be fully embodied by a real person.

  • Women will never experience the fully embodied divine masculinity of a man until they fully embody their divine femininity.

    There ^ I fixed it for you.

    You had your chicken and egg backward.

Scroll Down to Read Other Opinions

What's Your Opinion? Sign Up Now!

What Girls & Guys Said

3 30
  • Since I was in fourth grade I always looked up to women I said girls are smart they will take over the world one day and I think there are some women out there that represent all of women should not be representing them because they have made it worse I like smart confident women who don't need to be acknowledged for what they've done because they know what they've done but there are women out there that have to be boisterous and loud and obnoxious and it takes away from what is really going on they are the ones that make women look bad there's too many titles for women it seems like everybody has to have some sort of title like I said I believe in women I believe that they are just as equal or even better than men in some different ways because you have to be honest they are the things that they have to go through and put up with I will back a woman on anything she wants to do until she gets loud and loses control then I will take a step back I will still be there but I will take a step back and say try it again a different way

  • a man's role has always been traditional whether it's today or in the past. that's never changed. the only thing that has changed is women's expectations for men which in many cases is unrealistic and some factors have no bearing on a man's role i. e. height.

    a man is born with no value and he must earn it while women are born with value which they must preserve. problem is, women aren't preserving their value and have already opted themselves out of the traditional woman role long before a man has the chance to have achieved the ability to fulfil his role.

    and because of this, men aren't not fulfilling their masculine role, they're taking a page out of women's playbook and choosing who to fulfil their role for. might seem unfair but that's how it is.

    why would a man need to have money, a car, a job, a home, be a provider for a specific woman when all the dudes whom that specific woman slept with didn't have any of those?

    sure we can make excuses she was young and dumb and lost her virginity in HS to the bad boy who certainly didn't fulfil any manly role of any sort or she has had multiple ONS in college with different dudes who didn't fill the traditional man role either but now she's older and expects her future husband to have those traditional man qualities just so he is be able to get what all other previous dudes she slept with got for free?

    as for the other dudes who got free sex, why would they ever need to grow up and become traditional men when they are getting what they want without ever needing to put in the work? why are there criminals who have been laid and hard-working middle-class men still virgins? women are the ones dictating who and which men get rewarded and men will always try to match the archetype that gets the most reward so really the finger shouldn't be pointed at men when it comes to traditional roles.

    this one more lie feminism has told women and young girls that having casual sex is empowering yet what it's done is incentivized a generation of boys to never improve and that in the long run hurts women more. throughout history, leaders are always the ones who get sex and for those dudes who aren't getting sex but see other dudes getting sex for putting in the bare minimum effort, why wouldn't they want to follow in their footsteps?

    thing is, men aren't choosing not being traditional, they're choosing not to be traditional with certain women because those women have already opted themselves out of their traditional role. every dude will eventually grow up and become traditional but only for the "right" woman i. e. she has good character, practices good habits, not promiscuous preferrable a virgin etc.

  • I think the real problem is that men are demanding trad wives, but those aren't the women they even chose to marry. If you put one next to the other, the man is 99% of the time going to pick the sexy girl. There is no demand for trad wives, thus no supply. I hear online, "there are plenty of men lining up for them!" Easy for people to say who aren't a part of that fictitious line. Men just go from hookup to relationship to marriage to divorce to hating women. There's never any accountability for them thinking with their dick 100% of the time and choosing the wrong women. It's women's fault, or it's the law's fault, or whatever.

    It's a big cop-out, because if they pretend moral women don't exist, then they think it's a great excuse and a free ticket to be immoral and/or wallow in self-pity.

    • I mean, I do believe that some men actually do want a tradwife, but not anywhere near the amount of men who are portrayed as wanting a tradwife.

    • That's very true actually! So many men will fawn over me and play the gentleman prince for 1-3 months knowing the ENTIRE time that I won't have sex until I have a ring. Then they will slowly ghost and that's that. If a man can't delay gratification with sex he probably can't do it with much else though so it's for the best in my case. But they will ove on with a girl who will have sex right away and then go on to resent and judge her for it!! They don't know what they want! They say they want the "good girl" with more traditional values but once they have her they can't appreciate what they have and start lusting after the more sexually casual girls.

  • There's no workable 50/50 union- women don't even want that.

  • You are right in a lot of ways. Number one not all men. Number two there are plenty of women who are like this too. People are fine to have their own relationship standards and what they want and don't want and what their needs are.

    If someone does not see eye to eye and it causes too big of a problem then it isn't meant to be. A lot of people though try to force someone to change. Force them to conform. Then they spend a long time trying to change and fix one another into being who they want to be instead of finding someone who makes them happy.

    Many times one person be it the man or the woman in the relationship expect the other person to put all the effort into things while offering nothing in return. One sided relationships are the worst and I would even go as far as to say abusive. There are plenty of women though who wound men.

    As you have said many men who are suppressing their nurturing side sometimes this comes from the other men and women in their lives telling them they can't. Same with crying. I am not at all saying someone should be a cry baby. That isn't attractive. But when someone cries over the loss of a family member or just has been under a lot of stress and a woman is always telling him "you need to get over it" and "I need you to be strong for me" etc and then she expects a man to suppress who he really is inside his own house. Those unexpressed emotions are going to come out at some point or another in one way or another. Women like that frankly aren't worth it and neither are types of men.

    But you also do understand that ALL women and ALL men are different. I believe we have soulmates and twin flames. Meaning that when you find the right person. IF you are a good person and you find the ONE. Then you will make each other happy and fulfil the wants and needs of the other person that one another might not have even known they had.

    Partners should be able to vent and speak to each other and be able to vent to one another. When you share a life with someone especially when married. You are going to know all their flaws. If you start to resent them then you're going to have a rough marriage too. There are plenty of women who vent all their problems as well. I think that it is healthy sometimes. Just to have someone to be able to talk to.

    You are SO right about what you said about one person being expected to put all the effort into the relationship and it being one sided. I do not have a problem with people who might be more "traditional" where the woman stays home but there is MOST of the time a give and take there.

    A woman should not have to work and then come home to do all the chores and everything else that is not healthy at all. It is also not heathy for a stay at home wife or mom. To expect her husband to work and pay all the bills and he is working his ass off but yet she refuses and even thinks it is sexist to be responsible for the house chores. That is not either.

    A relationship should be about love. If you love someone you will love them enough to want them to be happy. I think I heard something. Two people for it to work. Have to both put 100 percent or 115 percent into each other and only expect 25 percent in return. If both people do this then most of the time it will work.

    BOTH parents should be spending a lot of time with their children though. But you do have to understand that if you were working all the time and come home and then your husband is asking you to do the dishes or something. You would probably freak out. That you jsut had to go to work and work your ass off. You should be able to come home and relax. But those kinds of marriages are NOT for everyone.

    I can not stand entitled women. Men do nice things for women and women do nice things for men because it is a nice gesture to show that they love them because they don't have to do it. Once a woman becomes entitled. I don't want to do anything for her. Not appreciative makes it even worse.

    If a woman expects a man to pay for dates and everything else but thinks it is sexist to hold her to any kind of roles... That seems like a double standard and she is the sexist.

    I think that what kind of marriage is right for two people obviously depends on two people. I know what I want. I know what I need. I know there is someone out there who will do this for me and I know that I will for her too.

    What matters is love

  • 50/50 doesn't exist. Here is an example: One parent doesn't want to allow their kids to have a smart phone at all, the other does. What do you do? Do they get a smart phone or not? You can't do two OPPOSITE things so it is NOT 50/50 in decision making. That is impossible and anyone that tries to have a 50/50 relationship just has lots of arguments and is miserable long term.

    Men often don't care much about a woman's "career" because before the kids are school age they would rather they raise the kids instead of some stranger. Once the kids are school age she can work. If she gets loans for college, SHE should pay for them, not the man that already earned what he has ON HIS OWN.

    Also, good men don't want a promiscuous woman or a past of promiscuity. That is one of the main things that disqualifies MOST modern women. They are immoral and have an unacceptable past that will FOREVER disqualify them from having a GOOD man. (A good man also would not have a past of promiscuity.)

    And the last point I will make is that house work is NOT nearly as demanding as a real full time job. I'd gladly do ALL of it myself for one month and add up the hours it takes to get it done and then after that point when I prove it doesn't even take HALF as many hours as working full time, she would be responsible for ALL house and yard work from then on if she was dishonest enough to try to claim it even came close to the amount of work as a full time job.

    • I don't think you would be a good fit for a traditional woman, you seem to have a bitter bachelor's attitude. Also running a household includes a lot more than just housework, she has to organize the entire family's schedules, watch and entertain the children, feed them and bathe them, shop for everything the family needs, care for any pets etc. and she NEVER gets to clock out.

    • Minxxie I agree. THe problem is that every person is different. What kind of relationship might be right for one couple might not for another that is okay. As long as both are happy.

    • What does happen sometimes is one person trying ot change the other. When it was never meant to be

    • Show All
  • Men didn’t choose this dynamic. Women did. Putting any of the responsibility for where we are with sex and gender roles on men is ignorant and hateful.
    We haven’t given you a “safe space” to be what you want? That’s literally how we got here. Ell oh ell! Maybe make better choices based on properly weighed investments and returns, rather than feelings and impulses. When men resist feminism it’s “toxic masculinity”, when we empower it we’re not nurturing your impulses enough? Geezus keywriste.
    Grow the eff up.

    • I can see why you are 48 and still raging at random women on the internet to pass the time :) (feel free to keep going but you are not worth any further responses)

    • Hahaha!

  • LMAO! Another certified "A whole group of people are trash" moment!

    Maybe the men you happen to be attracted to or you have met happen to not want that?

    First of all, in the picture (then one with the two circles), I do not a agree with a lot of things for both men and women so maybe people have different views of what a "true man" and "true woman" is? Maybe check what you think as a "true man"?

    Other than been the solo breadwinner (which in our defense, it's getting harder and harder) and having your wife been a housewife, I want to do every other "traditional" role that men were supposed to do. I want to lead, I want to protect my wife, I want to be a great lover, I want to take her out and have her stand in my side proudly etc.

    The problem is, I have been rejected twice. A lot of girls I see around chose guys that do NOT have these values and then complain. A lot of other girls are also ignored by the "real men" because of the vibes they bring.

    Real men are here, maybe they just don't like you because you are not a "real woman"? Or maybe you should stop choosing the wrong men? I'm just saying...

    • Everyone gets rejected, even supermodels. A mature person doesn't let what is a normal part of life make them bitter and whiny. That is your main problem right there, let it go, don't allow it to ruin your attitude, and keep looking. If they were not head over heels for you they did you a favor by rejecting you! They left you available for the right person. We need to stop shaming people for realizing someone isn't right for them and refusing to lead them on out of guilt or a feeling of obligation! That's a good thing!!

    • I don't allow it to ruin me, lol. That's what you get from my comment? I actually understand the game and for the first time it just happened yesterday that I had the epiphany to truly "play" for the first time. My comment wasn't about me...

  • Referring to your venn diagram. I find that nowadays, many people have traits that are more varied across the board, regardless of gender.

    Relationships are a partnership, therefore both men and women need to learn both masculine and feminine traits, eg. you have working couples who trust their kid to a babysitter.

    By biblical standards, men are providers, yes. But women are also providers of different things. Men provide financially, Women provide a warm home, like you said. Men provide security, Women provide stability (men may be the head of the household, but women are the neck). Amongst many other things.

    From both perspectives, a relationship should be about what YOU CAN GIVE, not what you can receive. As a man, you do not pay the bills IF she makes your home clean and cozy, you do it because YOU LOVE HER. Likewise, as a woman, you do not clean the house, make him coffee, and do other things for him IF he provides for you, you do it because YOU LOVE HIM. People need to quit thinking so much about what they can receive or gain, but instead more about what they can give.

    Every partnership has its own dynamic. Sometimes the woman has more "masculine" energy than the man, and they make it work. Sometimes, both are more effeminate, and thats ok. And ideally, everyone should have both masculine and feminine "energy", and if they do not, they should learn those traits. Eg. when dad loses his job, mom (assuming she has a job) has to tap into her masculine side, and become the financial provider. Dad still needs masculine traits as a protector, but has to tap into the feminine side now as a caretaker for his family.

    More importantly, the person in leadership within a relationship should not be the one providing more than his/her partner, and the person following in tow should not be bearing the brunt of maintaining the family and relationship. There has to be a middle ground of compromise and acceptance somewhere in between.

    And being the "submissive" partner does not entitle you to sitting back and letting your other half take the reins alone.

    A co-pilot does not sit behind the pilot and merely observe and agree with everything. Instead, the co-pilot is actively involved in the control of the aircraft, albeit as "pilot monitoring". The co-pilot takes care of monitoring the instruments on the aircraft, handling the radio with ATC, among various other responsibilities, while the pilot flies the aircraft. And when the aircraft can be put on autopilot, the pilot helps the co-pilot with some of his duties as well. And that is what a relationship should look like, regardless of being "traditional" or "modern". It is a two-way road. Share the load. Give as much to your partner as you can. Show appreciation. And take on his/her load when he/she is unable to handle it alone.

    • Also, I realise this was written mostly from a female perspective, which is why some of the guys here are not very happy about it? Because there is a whole male perspective regarding this issue that may not have been addressed. But thats ok, this mytake was meant for guys to read anyway.

  • Well the other way around is also the case.

    Lots of women expect men to fill their traditional roles, but the women refuse to give what such a traditional men would expect.

    In fact, both genders expect the things they love about "traditional role" from the other gender. But they want to evade/dodge when they have to behave in a traditional way that is not on their direct interests.

  • tldr, I will not read a wall of post, but I will say that both men and women are responsible for the demise of west, luckily i will be out of it in a few months

  • Such an ironic post. I would argue the majority of the "complaining comes from "modern" women seeking "traditional" men

  • Great mytake

  • I just want a girl who won't cheat.

  • I think I agree with you. Especially the statement in the beginning.
    Still This is hard to read without over looking all the bias contradictions, And lack of analysis.
    I’m a very analytical person so I’m not connecting with your article the way I think your intent is.
    I’m definitely on the side of equality and that both sex’s need to take responsibility for there relationship and not just reap the benefits.
    You obviously want men to take responsibility for changing with the times while still bringing value to this world, but placed no burden on women to reciprocate for those men that change. although you identify good traits that men should strive for it’s not emphasized enough in my opinion.
    Lastly your conclusion marks it all as a feminist rant against men because you don’t agree with there choices. Kinda ruins several great points throughout your piece.
    I hope you expand your opinions and whatever some asshole did to you in the past you continue to move forward.

  • Bravo! I skimmed through cause I'm at work. This is great. And your reference to the Bible, back them things had different meanings so the part of submission is not the same as what is taught in churches. It was all twisted around.

    • Thank you! And yes, the bible is more twisted and mistranslated and misinterpreted than most people would ever want to admit!

    • Totally. And if you ask someone in depth questions, some get annoyed and don't answer. Lol.

    • Or if you ask them to make a point and then mention the rest of the context for whatever they cherry-picked they blow up! hahaha

    • Show All
  • Yawn yawn

  • Not only do I not want a traditional woman/conservacuck as I might call them but I don't even want a woman in my life. I've seen too many bitches and whores, especially on this app, for me to want a girl anymore

  • I don't need to read all that none sense. The truth is nobody was concerned about femininity or masculinity other than trying to optimize their own to improve their looks and be more appealing to the opposite sex until feminism came along. Feminism did the job it was designed to do and did it very well creating competition and division between male and female and finally breaking the bond between both. And that is exactly what it is today a broken bond and division. And despite men claiming to be feminist men can't be feminist unless they are effeminate as the very word feminist related to femininity aka the female gender. Additionally the so called patriarchy is in actually God's order not man's order. When they refer to talking down the patriarchy what they are actually implying is removing God's natural order. And it isn't possible anymore for men to fulfill a man's traditional role because women have torn down all possibilities of men fulfilling their traditional roles. It wasn't men that failed to fulfill their traditional role that is something that only be claimed by women.

  • I agree in general however there are ZERO traditional women. You're talking about a man getting a woman with a career to give it up... it's already too late at that point. The woman is ruined and can never become completely feminine. However men can give up any past and turn that into wisdom moving forward completely masculine. Yet then when he cannot find a woman to be completely feminine the only way to justify a relationship is to further extract some sort of value somewhere else from the relationship.

    This is how I am. I'm ultra masculine down to a T, everyone tells me so and I get a lot of attention over it. However I expect an ultra feminine which includes innocence for example. I'm not going to wife a non Virgin. That's not feminine sleeping around and I just won't, i have no weak areas and so i expect a woman with no weak areas in her femininity. So now to date a woman I will not marry nor be faithful and many women accept it because they want a masculine man so badly and men like myself are rare.

    Its a big hole in your post. And it's the only hard rule women cannot go back on but you're also not going to turn a 60hr a week aggressive female ceo into a pleasant feminine housewife. Some changes one gets from these kinds of careers cannot be backtracked easily if at all. So from my perspective women are ruining themselves permanently while men are waiting for an incentive to step up. Why step up if there is no reasonable expectation of getting the prize? I did but it's just how I am but these other dudes have no chance and they know it so why bother?

    • Women are still human beings who will always have individual goals and passions beyond just raising your kids. You will need to accept that as reality because you will never find this perfectly subservient robot woman you are looking for. Everyone has weaknesses and shortcomings, even you!

    • "beyond just raising your kids" you mean their? I mean I don't play that game. That's why I scooped up an 18 yo girl. Older women are already ruined.

    • How long before your little girl child is ruined?

    • Show All
  • Show More (13)