We're women naturally submissive to men in ancient and evolutionary times?

[William4447]

[RebelinSteel]

You are mixing up what submissive is within a society is. Not all men fought, not all men had positions of power. In pretty much every ancient and modern society you have groups of people who are the elites, the middle class, working class and the serfs, slaves etc.

if you look at a woman in the elite of society, she had servants, slaves etc, both guys n girls. She could decide if a guy lived or died or was sold, that is not a submissive person. Drop down a level to the middle classes (various names but same thing) they were above everyone below them but below those above them.

there is no natural about is as such, the only natural thing I think is that humans will naturally have different levels of authority, top layer, near top layer, middle layer, next lower layer, bottom layer and slaves. A guy or girl sitting in the bottom layer or as a slave has zero choice but to do as told by those above them.

[William4447]

I'm talking about hunter gatherer and tribal life, pre established societies before society was fully established. Pre society if you will

[RebelinSteel]

Exactly the same You have people that rule a tribe and those that dig latrines. A tribal leaders wife could do what the fuck she wanted to anyone below her. It’s very much human nature. A latrine digger is never going to tell some one above them to dig their own holes.

[William4447]

Why rewrite history? Neither one of us lived back then, men were tribal and immoral before we developed good morals systems universally. They could rape and beat there wife. Women were weaker. Women had to depend on men for survival. I'm not saying they were necessarily submissive but we lived more animilistically

[RebelinSteel]

The irony in your sentence lol. Humans will always have those that have the power and those that do not. A guy in power has his choice of women, they then have power over all lesser men, ergo they are submissive to her.

[William4447]

U missed the point about strength and this was ancient times not universal modern times with liberal ideas and girls have weapons now or more tools to Exercise

[RebelinSteel]

I will say it again slowly Human nature has people that are elites and those that are not An elite guy will have an elite girl, she is above other guys, ergo they are submissive to her, It’s very basic human nature.

[William4447]

But how would a girl become an elite in those days man? Maybe in Egypt or Rome or in some kind of advanced society, but not this. I'm talking about cavemen, tribal life, hunter gatherers.

[William4447]

Also I'm not submissive to corrupt Elites.

[RebelinSteel]

You are face it

[The_Sexpert]

Of course
I'm not sure it's always "natural" though

[IslaTheWitch]

no, they were equal. Men naturally appreciated women and their contributions to the tribe or family group. They were aware that only together they can secure the future of their kids and their tribe/group

[William4447]

Men fought and protected and women stayed home and nurtured children

[Agape93]

No, that was done because of society created and enforced by men. Subservience isn't a natural state for people.

[CrabCakes11]

No. Women were more equal to men since the division of labor was very similar

[William4447]

I'm talking about evolutionary cave men days buddy, if you believe in evolution. If you don't you don't have to comment on that part

[William4447]

And equality isn't all about work buddy it's how ur perceived and treated and how much autonomy you have

[CrabCakes11]

Are you dense? I’m talking about early humans, which is what I’m assuming you’re talking about since you used a nonsense term like “evolutionary cave men” which doesn’t mean anything

[CrabCakes11]

Yes. And they had that because of equal division of labor

[William4447]

I'm not dense I'm trying to be respectful

[CrabCakes11]

You’re doing a terrible job at that, “buddy”

[William4447]

No ur just never satisfied and can't have a back and forth historical and scientific discussion. U can't handle diverse ideas and information.

[CrabCakes11]

Lol ok

[William4447]

My question is more about pre established societies, hunter gatherer and tribal life

[William4447]

You bring up good points my friend but I like linear im autistic

[CrabCakes11]

What do you think I’m talking about?

[William4447]

Early society

[CrabCakes11]

My point applies to both

[Dargil]

Yes, but to some extent, by force. Like Muslims now.

[jahaims]

Still depended in the cultural and societal norms of the society they were in

[jahaims]

On*.

[goebenbreslau]

yeap. and still women are dependent on men at a lot of things.

[RedInnocent69]

No, but generally physically weaker.

[Anonymous]

they were submissive to men until the 1960s