Sexual Relationships 
Sexual Health Also, this is hypothetical.
+1 y
Should men be allowed to vote on abortion laws and issues?
Anonymous
Just asking since the biggest complaint about men weighing in on the issue is 'it's not up to you to decide what a woman can do to her body.' So if a man isn't allowed to tell a woman if she can or can't have an abortion, should they even be allowed to vote on abortion laws?
Also, this is hypothetical.
Also, this is hypothetical.
Select gender and age to cast your vote:
Updates:
+1 y
Not even going to lie, I'm surprised anyone even voted for 'no' lol
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What Girls & Guys Said
49 120I don't think men should have any say over whether a woman does or does not have an abortion whatsoever BUT I also think that IF the woman decides on keeping a child regardless of the father's disagreement and it can be proven that he was tricked into impregnating her (however that even works because every responsible person should use condoms?) he should be exempted from paying child support.
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@Aeon_Flux_21 my name is not jasper 😂
@Jxpxtxr B-but Jasper, the man has his own IMDb page, Jasper:
https://www.imdb.com/name/nm0075359/?ref_=nv_sr_2
He is a legit STAR! Can't you feel the power, Jasper? :D
if he is the dad he has a say so but anyone out side the family factor has no say in it, because it takes his sperm to make the baby. no feminist can say other wise. even if it does sound out of place.
no because its not there body and they might not even stay with his baby momma after that.
It is the babies body too. And the baby is his too.
@Thisperson98 At the moment of legal abortion there's no baby, no child. Just a pea or bean sized blob of cells without conscience or ability to feel.
@Thisperson98 and no proof of paternity either.
@Thisperson98 There's no proof he caused the pregnancy.
i hear you about it being a woman's right to choose but it's also an tax and budgetary issue. it's a healthcare issue. for some it's a moral issue. so everyone who will be affected, which is every tax paying citizen, should have a say
Yes, more than half of the babies being aborted are male. Who else will speak for them?
Say that to the Chinese and Indian people 🙄 Also the biggest populations in the world, so no you are so wrong.
Yes it is not her body that is so selfish it's the baby's body and men are a part of it eventually.
Yes they should, especially if it's his baby. If he doesn't want this baby killed then it shouldn't be killed.
If he doesn't want his baby killed then maybe he shouldn't be having sex with girls who aren't pro-life.
@lumos Wow. Just freaking wow.
I know right? Mindblowing logic.
@lumos With the same logic a man should force a woman to have an abortion if she doesn't want it. If she wants a baby, then she shouldn't be having sex with someone who is pro choice.
Hahaha no. The logic is about only being with people who have the same views as you when it comes to matters like this. Not to force those with opposite views. Also pro-choice =/= forcing someone to have an abortion. That's literally the opposite of pro-choice because he would be taking her choices away. Do you even logic?
@lumos And what about his choice? That's still his baby. He doesn't have the right to say what does and doesn't happen to his own child? You're disgusting.
His choice is to be with someone who is on the same page as him.
@lumos And her choice isn't? Most abortions are just whores who couldn't keep their legs closed, or knew a guy was a scum bag and still chose to sleep with him because she's an idiot. You're seriously a hypocrite and your "morals" are EXTREMELY questionable. You think something is okay in one situation and not the other simply because you're too wrapped up in the fact that you have ovaries and a uterus. You think you and other women are these special snowflakes and victims in a "man's world" but you're not. Someone who has subjective morality is a horrible person to be around.
Of course it is her choice as well to be with someone who has the same views as her, I don't think I ever even implied otherwise? You do know that women can get pregnant in serious relationships too, even if they use condoms and/or other forms of contraceptives? Accidents to happen even if you take precautions in an intimate relationship. So to say that only "whores" get abortions is quite a harsh generalization. The guy is then just as much of a whore if that's the case.
do happen*
@lumos So if pregnancy is that bad that a woman is willing to murder her child shouldn't she be better off never having sex. Never having sex is the only 100% way to not get pregnant. If pregnancy is THAT bad, shouldn't she just get herself castrated so she'd never have to worry about that? When you have sex you take the risk, no matter what form of contraceptives you have in place you're accepting that risk. Abortion is just a way to avoid responsibility.
It's not just the pregnancy, it's the economical situation, maturity etc. that can also dictate whether having a child or not is a smart idea. Bringing unwanted kids into an already overpopulated world isn't exactly ideal. As for your castration argument, just because a woman at a certain point in her life feels unfit to be a mother due to a variety of reasons, it does not mean that she doesn't want to have kids later on when these issues have been resolved. And even though sex can create a life, it isn't all that sex is about. I'd say having an unwanted kid is even more irresponsible than recognizing that you're not fit to be a mother and your body isn't fit to bring a baby to this world.
Aaaannnd the same could be said about men, if they cannot watch their partner getting an abortion then maybe they shouldn't be having sex in the first place either? We can talk in circles like this all day and you can put the blame on women all you want.
@lumos A woman has just as much of a role in pregnancy as the man does. So many women on here want to blame men but what about the woman herself. If pregnancy is that bad, then be responsible and don't have sex. That's the only way you're not going to get pregnant. If you're not ready to have a child then you're not ready for sex. If you're not financially secure to have a child then you're not financially secure to have sex. If you don't want a child then don't have sex. If you want to partake in something that comes with HUGE responsibilities and you don't want those responsibilities then castrate yourself.
Actually considering that the woman carries the baby for 9 month's and the guy's "duty" can be over in just as fast as 30 seconds I don't think the man's role in pregnancy is just as big. Both are equally responsible though but all I see is you blaming women and calling them whores for getting pregnant. So tf are you talking about really? And like I said, sex =/= pregnancy, that's why contraceptives exist, so don't even start with that bullshit argument :D
@lumos I'm just done. Goodbye now.
Men should be able to vote on whether an abortion issue becomes a law but with individual circumstances, the couple should discuss together. ultimately being the womans body and her decision.
So basically on she decides.
@Thisperson98 takes his input and yes decides. But aortion laws in a community should be decided by all voters
What is the point of his input if she won't listen to him?
@Thisperson98 who says she won't listen to him? the president has all sorts of advisors giving their opinions to him and im sure some of them he takes. Hopefully she makes the best decision for her based on all the information she has, which includes the input of the father
Unfortunately the new president and his group of grumpy, old, rich men will be making that decision for you!
i agree because ultimately it is his child as well in the case of his partner/ex not wanting to keep the baby.
I personally think k father's should have a say in abortion. If a woman doesn't want a kid she can abort it. If a man doesn't sucks for him and he gets stuck paying child support forever. I think if the father wants the kid (assuming he isn't abusive or a rapist all that stuff) the woman shouldn't be allowed an abortion and the father can get full custody of the child and if the dad doesn't want the kid he should be allowed to not pay child support.
But you'd force a woman to carry out a pregnancy against her will and go through labor and childbirth against her will? Imagine that happening to you. TRY it.
Forcing a girl to carry out an unwanted pregnancy and to go through labor and childbirth is worse than rape.
@jacquesvol if I got pregnant and wanted an abortion but my boyfriend wanted to raise it that's what I would do. I believe in equality and I believe if the baby has a chance at a happy life it should be given it.
@jacquesvol why don't you try to imagine having a child in the womb and having it killed when you could have given it a great life.
@Zendrya Just the idea of a forced pregnancy, labor and childbirth is enough to scare me.
@jacquesvol Then maybe she should use some form of birth control. The pregnancy is just as much a consequence of her actions as much as the fathers. Also, if doctors don't want to take the risk of providing an abortion in the case of a healthy pregnancy, why should they be forced to when one parent is willing to take custody of the child?
@Zendrya I agree with you completely. That is what I have been saying for years. It's only logical and fair to both of them.
"I believe in equality" So MEN should be able to relinquish responsibility after sex, even if their partner disagrees, but women can't? "I believe if the baby has a chance at a happy life it should be given it." Why isn't the same the case for men paying child support, then? It'll make the baby have a happier life. "why don't you try to imagine having a child in the womb and having it killed when you could have given it a great life." why don't you try to imagine having a child born and not giving it monetary support, when you could have given it a great life? "if I got pregnant and wanted an abortion but my boyfriend wanted to raise it that's what I would do." That's cool for you. That's not every woman, though.
Here are some of the effects of how awful and barbaric forced pregnancy is. It's forcing women to risk all of the following, against their will: Postpartum hemorrhage - a life-threatening condition - occurs in nearly 1 in 5 births.[29] Tearing of the genitals occurs in almost all (90%) births.[9] In some cases, even the anus and rectum is torn, leading the anus and vagina to form one single space.[10] This can lead to fecal incontinence. Similarly, childbirth can lead to urinary incontinence, and it does for 49% of mothers for at least a year after childbirth.[11] Almost all (96% of) women experience at least one postpartum health problem for at least 2 months after giving birth[13] and almost half of women experience persistent genital and/or pelvic pain for at least three months, “most often as burning, cutting, or radiating”.[25] Therefore, the trauma of childbirth lasts far longer than "just one day!"
As one study asserts, "when the intensity scores [of postpartum pain] were totalled for each of several sites, the accrued pain intensity in a woman's body reached a mean that fell into the severe category."[27]. Contrary to the idea that pelvic prolapse is uncommon or at least heals quickly, pelvic organ prolapse is detected in nearly half of 60+ year old women who have not had a hysterectomy.[7] A main reason for pelvic organ prolapse is childbirth.[8] Trauma from birth is not always just physical but also often psychological. 1 in 3 women experience a traumatic birthing event, and at least 3 post-traumatic stress symptoms.[24][26] Post-traumatic Stress Disorder rates due to childbirth for wanted pregnancies (9%)[1] is literally comparable to the PTSD rates of combat veterans (2-17%)[2]. And that’s just the childbirth.
That’s probably after (as is the case for most pregnant women) experiencing moderate to severe nausea and/or vomiting that is so extreme that it leads to hospitalization in 20% of cases, and in other cases, typically has a negative impact on ability to perform activities of basic daily living: even simply eating (you know, the thing that people must do in order to stay alive?)[3]. In the 20% chance that a woman does not experience nausea and vomiting, there is an almost certain chance that she will experience heartburn (95% of pregnant women will experience at least one of the two; most will experience both).[4] Aside from vomiting your guts up and/or feeling like your chest is burning from the inside, other symptoms experienced by a majority of pregnant women include: back pain[5] (which doesn’t go away for more than a year after childbirth for most women[12]); bloating, constipation, diarrhea, and/or IBS[6]; gingivitis (which typically involves swelling and bleeding of the gums[13]
More alarmingly, 1 in 6 pregnant women develop potentially life-threatening complications.[30]
Pregnancy also increases risk of stroke.[37] Many less severe illnesses and infections are also more common during pregnancy mainly because the pregnant woman’s immune system is hampered in order to prevent the body from rejecting the fetus, which is technically a foreign organism. Thus, flus are more common, more dangerous, and more deadly in pregnant women.[19][20]
From LiveScience: "Having a baby makes mom's body turn on itself... The act of giving birth raises the chance that a woman's body will attack itself with autoimmune diseases... because of the cells from the fetuses."[38]
I copied and pasted the above from here, where you can see the list of sources: www.holonis.com/.../why-fathers-should-not-be-able-to-veto-abortions
... So basically forced pregnancy is literally torture.
Any man willing to force a woman into that, isn't fit to be a father.
@mistixs nice wikipedia copy and paste
nice advocacy of literally torturing women and forcing them to undergo severe health risks
@mistixs Of course pregnancy and sex carries risk, but the issue is concerning the child's life and the paternal rights of the father. If women decide that pregnancy and bearing children isn't for them, then they simply can avoid getting pregnant from the start. Using some form of birth control, or total abstinence isn't that hard of a concept to grasp. No one is limiting birth control options, but abortion does affect other lives than just that of the mother's.
@Zendrya At the moment of legal abortion there's no baby, no child. Just a pea or bean sized blob of cells without conscience or ability to feel.
@RegularTK421 yeah it effects other lives, of course. but tell me this. if a person was in a great deal of pain and there was no recovering, would you support their right to assisted suicide so that they could end their suffering? "but wait!!! other lives are affected too!!! their loved ones will be sad!" is basically the equivalent logic being used here. and consent must be continuous. just because you're someone's father doesn't give you permission to allow your child to violate someone else's bodily autonomy. whether that be by rape or forcing a continued pregnancy
@RegularTK421 Doctors risk being killed by extemists, clinics were arsoned. An abortion involves less risk than pregnancy and childbirth.
@jacquesvol And after I murder you, there is no feeling. Just an empty cold corpse and decaying cells. Should we not even bother seeking justice for your murder?
@mistixs I agree with euthanasia. I view it as an act of compassion.
@RegularTK421 The SCOTUS already ruled about it.
@RegularTK421 there's a difference. he's EXPERIENCED life. that differentiates him from, say, a plant. whereas a fetus's complete lack of sentience & feeling, places them into the same moral category of plants in my opinion. just like plants, they've never had such sentience
@mistix Here is a key difference though. In Euthanasia, the actual patient is making the decision. Even if the family is emotionally affected, one is making the best health decision for themselves. In the case of abortion, women who advocate for abortion treat is as though it is the only method of birth control ever conceived. It also happens to be the most expensive and dangerous form of birth control. Not only that, but there is technically a life inside of her womb, and her decision affects not only her body, but the child's body as well. This child has zero say in such decision, not to mention the father. In cases of rape, incest, or if the mother's life is in danger then yes I support abortion as an emergency procedure. It's not exactly more cost effective than conventional birth control.
@mistixs Guess that boils down to perspective then. You don't view an unborn child as a life, but millions of Americans do. I still don't understand why it is such a dire need to resort to abortion, when a little bit of foresight and birth control can prevent such pregnancies in a much safer and cheaper way.
@RegularTK421 abortion is also about a person making the best health decision for their own body. if you're opposed to abortion in general then I actually find that to be a more respectable view than people who believe abortion should be legal but fathers should be able to veto them. b/c in the former case, they can at least pretend to be caring about a "life". in the latter case, men controlling women's bodies is literally what they are unabashedly explicitly advocating for. as for life, plants are life, but most of us wouldn't advocate plants have the right to utilize our bodily resources against our will. anyway, if abortion is illegal, and women are made to have the responsibility to pay the full physical price of the pregnancy even if they don't want to, then men should be given an equal amount of responsibility that they can't opt out of. thus men should be required to pay the full financial price of the pregnancy and birth expenses. she pays the physical price,
@RegularTK421 he pays the financial price. this is equality. otherwise is giving men special treatment by letting them off the hook far easier than women.
@RegularTK421 not that I'm referring only to the costs of the pregnancy and birth. after the baby is born, then he can relinquish financial responsibility the same way that women can
@mistixs Except it should not be men in general or even society at large. If two consenting adults have sex and the result is pregnancy, they should be required to pay for it. If they opted in for abortion coverage for their health insurance plan, more power to them. I shouldn't be forced to cover abortions in my plan because people can't control their bodies. I don't see why I as a divorced 31 year old man, need to have my insurance premiums go up because abortions need to be covered for women and couples that are too stupid to wear a 90 cent condom beforehand. Also, a fetus isn't a plant, it's a developing human life inside of a womb. We are not talking about oak trees. A woman who opens her legs wide and allows a penis to penetrate her vagina willingly, is responsible for her actions, along with the man who stuck his penis in there. It's really that simple. Not to mention, there is a morning after pill that's much cheaper than abortion. A pill, me and my ex wife utilized once.
@RegularTK421 If you live in a desertic region of Alaska, why should your fire insurance be influenced by fires in CA? Spreading the risks and costs over as many people as possible, that's what ALL insurance companies do.
@RegularTK421 "If two consenting adults have sex and the result is pregnancy, they should be required to pay for it." Exactly. If the mother is required to pay the physical price, then it'd only be fair and equal for the father to be required to pay the financial price.
@mistixs I think they should both be held liable for the costs. You keep trying to make it where the male only is responsible, he is equally responsible, and so is the woman. It doesn't matter how they pay it, and honestly it is between the both of them.
@jacquesvol Actually rates are affected only by state claims. California fires have no effect on Alaskan rates. The only exception to that is flood insurance, which follows under the national flood insurance program. Flood insurance is unique in these regards. Yes, I understand what insurance and a risk pool is, and like I said only in those select few cases should abortions be provided by Insurance or even taxpayers, those being rape, incest, or in a medical emergency. They should not be provided on demand, because it increases claims, overhead and costs and takes away funding for other medical needs. Cancer and heart disease are much more important to cover. In contrast to paying for an expensive optional procedure for a couple who were too lazy to use any form of birth control.
@mistixs If a couple doesn't want to pay for their abortion procedure that didn't result from incest, rape, or is a medical emergency, than the courts should go after both the man and the woman. Hit them both with liens and asset seizures until the costs are recovered.
@RegularTK421 " a couple who were too lazy to use any form of birth control. "
about half of pregnancies in the US are unintended: www.guttmacher.org/.../unintended-pregnancy-united-states That makes many 'lazy people'.
And millions can't even afford a simple medical visit.
@RegularTK421 since the women has full physical responsibility it is fair, equal, and equitable for men to have full financial responsibility. Otherwise it is unequal because it is expecting women to sacrifice much more and have much more responsibility than men when it comes to having children
@mistixs Again, no one forced her to have sex and get pregnant. Women are not mindless babies who are exempt from financial responsibilities. Both the man, and her, are responsible for their mutual outcome. She shouldn't be off the hook because biologically her body is the one that carries the child. Now, I do agree with the traditional concept that a pregnant woman should be taken care of by her man, but the parents are mutually responsible for their child and the costs associated with that child.
@RegularTK421 No one forced him to have sex and get a woman pregnant, either. If the man didn't want to take equal responsibility (which would involve taking greater financial responsibility to balance out her greater physical responsibility) then he shouldn't have had sex.
@mistixs They are both responsible, as I have stated. If they don't pay for their pregnancy or abortion, then the courts should go after their assets. They can enact payroll deductions, or place liens on their property until such costs are recovered. If the man happens to have the assets or income, then so be it they can seek full payment from him, or vice versa. It doesn't matter if they recover costs from they equally, or only from one of them. The issue is that taxpayers, Insurers or the healthcare providers shouldn't take on the financial loss. This takes away from care that sick people need, rather than bailing out a couple that couldn't plan or afford their pregnancy, which as far as I'm concerned, was optional.
The exception being where a woman really didn't have a choice, Such as rape, incest, or if an unforeseen complication puts her life in danger.
them equally* not they.
@RegularTK421 It still is HER womb, her domain.
@jacquesvol It affects more than just her body and her womb, especially if women are trying to throw the costs of their actions onto others. Not to mention that the life she is terminating, isn't hers. Also by that logic, suicide should be acceptable because after all, it is their body and their decision. Abortion is worse because you are terminating a life that was jointly created that isn't even hers. I don't want national and insurance laws that pay for abortions like fucking candy, when it detracts from those who really have legitimate medical conditions such as cancer, tumors, or heart disease. Ridiculous a grown ass woman can't avoid getting pregnant in the 21st century, not to mention if they fail to take a morning after pill. It's really not that complicated, if women don't want to get pregnant, then there are plenty of effective and cheaper measures to ensure that they don't.
@RegularTK421 a reasoning with religious background
@RegularTK421 and yes, suicide IS acceptable.
@jacquesvol No religious reasoning behind any of my arguments. I'm not religious, but I'm not going to patronize adult women and treat abortions as though they should be free and available on demand. A woman chooses to get pregnant. Therefore, she and the man responsible can decide and pay for their treatment options.
@RegularTK421 "woman chooses to get pregnant" Half of pregnancies in the US are unplanned.
@TK421 you're maybe not religious anymore but you use their arguments. And controlling women's wombs IS patronizing, just like not allowing suicide.
@jacquesvol Every adult knows that sex can lead to pregnancy. It is their responsibility to take preventive measures. By their, I mean the man and the woman who consent to vaginal sex. It's a very basic biological concept. I don't care if women get their tubes tied, have an IUD device implanted, or use a diaphram or condom. There are many birth control options out there. I do not, support abortions paid for by the taxpayer or an insurance pool, because it detracts from other care for conditions that resulted from misfortune, rather than from a lack of planning.
@jacquesvol So no, you are the one patronizing them by saying half of all pregnancies are unplanned or mistimed. It's completely irrelevant. Also, because the man is equally responsible for the child, he should have some sort of input or say in the outcome of the pregnancy, even when concerning abortion. It's his child too.
@RegularTK421 People insisting on male control over abortion hope some those males will stop women from having an abortion. That's patronizing. Don't hide behind the financial aspect of it. So much happens in society for which we pay much steeper bills without getting the fits.
As much as I'm sure women want revenge for the 19th Amendment taking so long, that is just unconstitutional.
It was only 67 years after men got the right to vote and even then it was primarily women who where against it what with the whole being forcibly conscripted into governmental services in order to do so.
What if a guy ends up getting a woman pregnant on accident and he wants to keep the kid and she doesn't? Does the guys view not matter then?
Sadly not until his is the body that is being effected. If we ever make it so guys carry the baby and all that comes with that then of course they should but as of now they deserve equal say once their is a living breathing child. Once the child can live outside of the woman's body everything should be up to both of them.
www.court-records.net/animationgk/miles-aha(d).gif
I actually agree with you. Men shouldn't have a vote on abortion laws since they ultimately do not decide whether a woman aborts her child.
But, they should be able to say no to abortions.
https://i.imgur.com/Cir21Zb.jpg
@jacquesvol Some number of chicks get pregnant and don't want abortion. 100% of them could not have been deceived about their birth control, and will not be forced by a court to pay child support for a child they didn't want for 18 years. QED. Anyone who thinks anything different is an idiot not even worthy of basic human rights... you know, like you don't think the fetuses you're aborting deserve.
@Notorisch_Arschloch I was never at the origin of an abortion, Arschloch.
Nope. Just like women should have no say whatsoever in whether a man decides to financially abort. Trapping a man or his wallet with a child should be a crime punishable by forced abortion, sterilization and 18 years prison, the same amount of time the woman tried to hook the man for.
And JUST LIKE rape cases fraught with false allegations, in the cases of "oopsies" where the woman claims her birth control failed, she should be presumed guilty until proven innocent.
Til then, women can just shut the fucking fuck up and be happy they have the right to vote (or not, since the direct result has been the steady decay of the west) and not question whether men should have the right to vote about ANYthing.
It's innocent until proven guilty not guilty until proven innocent. And your argument is pretty good but really 18 years in prison for not wanting an abortion? Come on now doesn't that violate the 8th amendment?
@BR0CK Point was it is NOT innocent until proven guilty in instances of a rape accusation. look it up and find out how many men accused how found it incumbent upon themselves to prove their innocence in order to avoid a sentence, even still to find their reputations destroyed after being found innocent. And as far as the 8th amendment is concerned, another interesting thing to look up would be how many men get raped while jailed awaiting trial for rape. Heartbreaking how many of them come out innocent but got raped because a man accused of rape enjoys a status barely above a child molester in jail. And 18 years in jail just to match how long she'd have gotten him financially trapped if her bullshit ass ruse had worked.
The 8th amendment is about no cruel or unusual punishment - 18 years in prison for not wanting an abortion. I don't know what that rape argument was. Also if a girl decides she doesn't want an abortion that doesn't always mean she's trying to "financially trap" him. Maybe she just wants a baby.
Well, every child is also a man's child, so I think that we should have a say. We just don't get pregnant because of biological reasons, but socially we're the same as you.
It depends on the law. Planned parenthood funding, for example, is sort-of an abortion issue. But it is not strictly a woman's issue because those taxes come from everyone. Plus, birth control is to everyone's benefit, which is a large chunk of what planned parenthood does.
Laws regulating the medical procedure of abortion, as far as sanitation standards and such, also affect everyone, because if a person's minor injury becomes a major complication resulting in a disability, everyone now has to pay for accommodating and caring for that disabled person.
However, the rights to have an abortion do not affect men in any way. But, it is very rare for a bill concerning abortion rights alone to ever be brought up in any legislative body. There is always going to be other things attached to the bill - both relevant and otherwise. If it ever happens, it makes sense to have the discussion on whether or not men should have any say. But it won't happen :-/
Republicans do that on purpose you know slip it in with a pro-health bill Democrats are in favor of in order to force anti-antiabortion laws into place.
@Valkyrie1 everyone does that on purpose. Unfortunately, it's the only way to compromise...
That's not a compromise it is a capitulation.
@Valkyrie1 it would be if democrats were actually doing the 'standing up for rights' thing that people seem to think they do. But they're not. They have business interests just like republicans do, and try to slip in things that benefit their lobbyists, just like republicans do. It's sad, but it's what we got :-/
They do to some extant to maintain the image but you have a point. Democrats in office right now are pussies because they are paid to be pussies.
@Valkyrie1 yeah :-/
yes fathers should have a fucking say..
Newwwwp
Yes because our tax payer money goes in to supporting abortions if the government decides to subsidize. So long as our money goes in to it, we get a say. I would actually not mind not being able to vote on it (apteral, it is something I will never physically experience) BUT ONLY under the single circumstance that abortion is not government subsidized in that case.
Don't want men to have a say in it - then pay for it yourselves. You can't have best of both worlds.
No it does NOT. Planned Parenthood is SPECIFICALLY not allowed to use government money for abortions BY LAW. And women who have procedures like D&Es performed either already miscarried or their LIVES are in danger. Even in situations where the government IS providing insurance and funding to a hospital the hospital and/or provider can refuse to even do that much for women if they're fucking catholic hospitals or clinics. So you tell me how ANY of that works out to you paying for an abortion through taxes.
@BellePepper my point still stands - if my money somehow goes in to it, I want a say. If not, as you have provided is supposedly the case, then by all means don't let me vote on it.
No it absolutely does not. Your point is I don't want to pay for it so it shouldn't happen. But you ALREADY don't pay for abortions so what is there for you to be pissed about? What is there for you to oppose if you're already not paying for something?
@BellePepper "so what is there for you to be pissed about" -The possibility that I actually DO have to pay for it? You can't be 100% certain about. Either some things may not be as they seem or could change at some point and my money would somehow end up there anyway.
Yes! Yes we can be 100% certain! Groups that get federal money have to keep records of all their expenditures for at least 5 years. There is no "some point". There is no point. None of your money pays for abortions so why do you keep having opinions on abortions?
@BellePepper First and foremost, I'm not even American. Not everyone here is. Every country's law could be entirely different. Besides, the argument here was about having or not having the right to vote on abortion, not about having an opinion on it. The latter I have the right to have. It is absurd to say that we can't even have opinions on it. So if my future daughter gets raped and people will be pushing for her to give birth, you're implying I can't express my opinion and tell them to go fuck themselves? Really? Am I supposed to just watch my daughter get decisions be made without her involvement? Fucking really? Absurd.
In the United Kingdom where we have free healthcare, we pay for our health service through taxes. I believe since i'm paying for it I should have a say in it too, i'm pretty much for abortion though.
Your argument was that if you had to pay for it you should get to decide on it. But you DON'T HAVE TO PAY FOR IT. So why do you think you should get ANY say? Guess what. If men weren't allowed to legislate about abortion there would be no laws against abortion so you wouldn't have to worry about it. So it's a nonissue.